PopUp Times

General => The Campfire => Topic started by: NightOwl on Feb 14, 2004, 11:12 AM

Title: Accusations against this "dieing" BB and members
Post by: NightOwl on Feb 14, 2004, 11:12 AM
while cruising other boards, I have noticed remarks (not nasty, but certainly less than admiring or respectful ) about PUT.  They claim that the place is dieing and wont survive.  I  ALMOST BELIEVE THEM!  Only half a dozen people here spend much time and effort in keeping things going.  Sometimes these posts are frivolous, sometimes almost pointless as some former members used to claim, but  often they are posting to fill a void which others dont  fill..  

Perhaps this board has outlived its importance to some of us?  Maybe it wont matter if it dies?  Should Dave even go to the trouble to keep it going after our subscriptions expire?   The time is soon coming when we will be asked to renew IF Dave decides to continue it.

I AM NOT ASKING WHO IS STAYING AND WHO IS LEAVING!  I am trying to get a discussion going here which might enlighten the administrators as to what the board needs if it is to remian an active and interesting place JUST IN CASE they want to continue it.

People often say, "Oh, well, it's winter--a lot of us cant camp  and have no camping news so we dont post on the board."

Then in summer they say, "Oh, well, we're all too busy with camping and outdoor activites to spend time at the keyboard."

Or, "Well, I've been here since the beginning and I already know--thanks to PUT and this board--whatever I need to know about PopUps and camping."

Or, "I've gone to the Dark Side and dont have much of an interest in popup camping anymore."

(By the way, I recognize all the above remarks as legitimate.)

WHY DO WE COME TO THIS BOARD NOW?  I come mainly  because my friends are here.  Is that enough for others of you?

 If the board is slow and boring, maybe people who dont participate much  could help liven it up.

If the board is slow and boring, maybe that is just normal and doesnt have a negative impact on its future and has nothing to do with the members' feelings of support for the board?

LET'S TALK ABOUT THIS  :W
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Post by: forestwalker on Feb 14, 2004, 12:43 PM
The board must be attractive to potential new members,as well as "old friends".Current members seem to do well with the "old friends" part of the equation.In my opinion,if we want to remain viable as a board,we should work on making the board more attractive to potential members.Perhaps we can ask more questions that would be of interest to
newcomers to pop up camping.Questions like,"How do you back up ?"Any tricks to setting up an awning","How can I improve the rate of water drainage out of my sink?","How would you rate your pop-up?","Which battery cable is 'Positive?".... They dont have to be posted as questions.They could be presented as advice,or in narrative form.It is my feeling that we can make the board more attractive to newcomers this way.I've tried, because I do care.This may require a modification of who has access to some parts of the board.Worth a try?
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Post by: NightOwl on Feb 14, 2004, 02:32 PM
Quote from: forestwalkerThe board must be attractive to potential new members,as well as "old friends".Current members seem to do well with the "old friends" part of the equation.In my opinion,if we want to remain viable as a board,we should work on making the board more attractive to potential members.Perhaps we can ask more questions that would be of interest to
newcomers to pop up camping.Questions like,"How do you back up ?"Any tricks to setting up an awning","How can I improve the rate of water drainage out of my sink?","How would you rate your pop-up?","Which battery cable is 'Positive?".... They dont have to be posted as questions.They could be presented as advice,or in narrative form.It is my feeling that we can make the board more attractive to newcomers this way.I've tried, because I do care.This may require a modification of who has access to some parts of the board.Worth a try?

forestwalker, you have obviously given this a lot of thought, so I've repeated your post. I think you have some really good and workable ideas for us to put into action.  This board can easily die of old age and inactiveity but only if we let it.  And the "questions" or information threads you mention may just help us to wake up and  keep our newer members coming back for more information and  chat.
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Post by: NCSunshine on Feb 14, 2004, 05:57 PM
I personally think that all the different sections help to make the board slow.  You might get 20 posts in one day but there could be one in each different section, therefore making it look like there is nothing going on.  I don't go to each section, because I don't get the chance to spend alot of time here.  Same reason for posting as little as I do, plus my life is pretty boring and I don't get to camp alot.  But I love camping alot!!!!

I'm sure that all the sections were made so that you would not have to sift through all the stuff you are not interested in, but then again, you might miss something that may would have been of interest to you or make you laugh
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Post by: moderator1 on Feb 14, 2004, 06:18 PM
Quote from: NCSunshineI personally think that all the different sections help to make the board slow.  You might get 20 posts in one day but there could be one in each different section, therefore making it look like there is nothing going on.  I don't go to each section, because I don't get the chance to spend alot of time here.  Same reason for posting as little as I do, plus my life is pretty boring and I don't get to camp alot.  But I love camping alot!!!!

I'm sure that all the sections were made so that you would not have to sift through all the stuff you are not interested in, but then again, you might miss something that may would have been of interest to you or make you laugh


This is an interesting point because Dave & I go back and forth on this one all the time.

In the "olden days" we only had a couple of forums and everything was posted there.  As the board grew folks asked for specific forums for different interest areas.  But this begs the question, how many is too many forums?

So far I find that it works well wen I use the button in the upper right "View New Posts".  This will show only the threads which have had new activity.

We can certanly reduce the number of forums, but which ones?
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Post by: Camperroo on Feb 14, 2004, 07:34 PM
I really don't think it is the board itself, I think it has to do with the paying a fee to use it.  If you notice in other forums people talk about how silly it is to expect forum members to have to pay a fee to join when there are so many other free forums out there.  I am not saying that to incite any riots, I am merely stating what it being said out in cyberspace.

This is a wonderful forum but it lost a lot of energy when people had to dig into their own pockets to continue on.

By the way does the magazine membership now include using the forum or is it still a separate fee?

I like this board because of the genteel nature of the members.  You go to some other boards and it gets kind of nasty at times.  I don't like that at all.
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Post by: NightOwl on Feb 14, 2004, 09:40 PM
Quote from: CamperrooI really don't think it is the board itself, I think it has to do with the paying a fee to use it.

This is a wonderful forum but it lost a lot of energy when people had to dig into their own pockets to continue on.

By the way does the magazine membership now include using the forum or is it still a separate fee?

I like this board because of the genteel nature of the members.  You go to some other boards and it gets kind of nasty at times.  I don't like that at all.

Camperoo, I TOTALLY  agree with you about the board losing energy when it went to a pay site.  When we changed over, I paid willingly  for myself and for about 7 or so other people with tight budgets to continue and have never been sorry.  (Interestingly, since then, some of them have just "abandoned " the board as if  it no longer interested them.)  

Leaving aside COMPLETELY the matter of being able to afford the  fee,  I cant figure out exactly WHY  switching to a pay board has had such a "dampening effect on the vitality and spontanaeity of the place.

I'd love some members like Camperoo to jump in here  and answer some of  my "wonderings"  about this.  Do you think it is  resentment over paying for something which is usually free in other places and once was free here?   Has the smaller member group made it less varied and less interesting?  I admit, we certainly lack the "whoosh" of fresh air we used to have when someone would  jump in and breathlessly announce that they were new and getting a popup and knew NOTHING and could we tell them EVERYTHING they needed to know "in 25 words or less"  ;) (joke)

We all asked for  more and more forums.  Maybe Steve is right to wonder if we have too many--maybe we would feel less fragmented  and feel  like the board was busier and  had more variety if we had fewer forums , but as he said, WHICH ONES would we be willing to give up?  Maybe instead of giving some up, we could combine them?


I miss the old days when it was a good-natured free for all (NOT the trolls though)  with Chubs and Suzey and  Camper Jones and  Debbie MacDougal and Miss Teri, B-Flat and  ThunderRock and RedNekRubberDuk and    some of the others just  having fun and all of us learning and sharing ideas.  Where did it all go?  Are we just too sophisticated about popups and camping for our own good?  Jaded?   Have we gotten old and dull  in our attitudes?  Is the board REALLY drab these days or do we just expect more of it than we have a right to?  

In the next few weeks, maybe we can help shape the board by giving this some thought as Dave and his crew of loyal helpers  consider what to do about the future of this website.  In a sense, it is OUR board since we now PAY for it--we are PAYING  CUSTOMERS  now and not just guests as we used to be.  Still, Dave owns it, IT IS HIS, although I am sure he wants it to be a product his customers will use and enjoy.
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Post by: deniski on Feb 14, 2004, 10:22 PM
I think everyone has different expectations about what this board is to them.  For me, for the main part - it's a good place to get my questions about camping with my (new to me) popup answered.  The people here are always nice and so far very helpful.  I don't expect to come here every day to chat, I just don't have time for that.  I do check the campground reviews for my area (Montana/Wyoming/Idaho) to see if I can answer any questions about places I might know about.  I also read  most of the messages that comes out in the general, fixit and product review boards.  I pay for this board because I think it is worth the price to me.  The moderators do a good job and I like the messages being split up into forums.  If everybody wanted to have fewer forums, it would be ok with me... but it works for me as it is setup now too!

just my 2 cents and happy valentines day!
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Post by: B-flat on Feb 14, 2004, 10:36 PM
Some people definitely don't like paying for the site and will leave after a while.  That might be some of the problem, but I do notice that there have been quite a few new members since Christmas and there's somewhere in a range of over 700 members.  More exposure and more sponsors should offset the costs of keeping the message board.  Many new friendships have been formed as a result of the message board and lots of camping is done and lots of information is shared.  I am not sure what the real answers are but PUT needs to continue to offer a variety of information and services if it is to remain at the top as far as Pop Up Camping is concerned.

 
Viewing the new activity posts is a convenience.  Also, you can see at first glance before hitting the "view new" which forums do have new posts because there is a yellow highlight.  I personally don't think it is that hard to figure out what to read or to post to.  The board just doesn't have as much in the way of posts that it used to.  Some of the folks have moved on up to Travel Trailers and they became more experience campers after studying and reading on this board.  After that, they must not have needed this site any longer.:eek:  Once all the info was obtained, maybe they just lost interest.  I understand that the magazine also includes the arvee club membership, but people still don't post.  Maybe there is some kind of fear associated with their not posting to the message board.  This is proably akin to what someone once said "You're gonna camp with some people you met on the internet?!"  There has been so many horror stories to do with use of the internet and maybe this is why there is a bit of fear in posting.  I think that there is enough security and privacy choices on the member's page to lay those fears to rest.  The only one that will stalk you is probably topcat when he is looking for food.;) :D   I will just abandon everyone for several days to camp at a bluegrass festival and NiteyOwl runs away for a while too.  Birol has a tendancy to disappear and to not post for a while, too.  Somehow, we all seem to return.
 
This may seem redundant, but will someone please tell us why they have not posted so far?  I'm  talking about members who have joined who just never seem to post for some reason.  Maybe they just wanted the magazine and that's all.
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Post by: Trlrboy on Feb 15, 2004, 05:51 AM
I post both here and on PUX.  I also check out several of the other popup related websites.  IMHO PUX seems to have a wider reader/poster base than PUT.  It's free.  Free is always better and will get you more members and with more members there is a wider selection of opinions and thoughts about camping.   One night around our campfire at a NTPUCA campout I asked if people cared which website they got their information from.  Out of about 15 people there, none cared.  1/2 the people seldom checked out any website at all and the rest said it didn't matter.  

If you are completely honest about PUT vs PUX, why would anyone pay to be on PUT?  I've been on PUT for a long time and paid the $30 because at the time I thought it was worth the money.  Does that $30 give me more information and PUX or some other site?  I don't think so but I wanted to give it a shot and see how it progressed and what the benefits would be as Dave brought PUT around.  

As to people posting, the content of the posts is what is important to me, not the number of posts a person has.
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Post by: NightOwl on Feb 15, 2004, 06:32 AM
Quote from: TrlrboyI post both here and on PUX.  I also check out several of the other popup related websites.  IMHO PUX seems to have a wider reader/poster base than PUT.  It's free.  Free is always better and will get you more members and with more members there is a wider selection of opinions and thoughts about camping.  

If you are completely honest about PUT vs PUX, why would anyone pay to be on PUT?  Does that $30 give me more information and PUX or some other site?  I don't think so but I wanted to give it a shot and see how it progressed and what the benefits would be as Dave brought PUT around.  


 Thanks, Bob, I knew we could count on you for some  remarks worth reading and thinking about. .  And as to PUX, I notice Dean and his mods do an excellent job of  stopping  things IMMEDIATELY  when someone starts pushing any "hot button issues"  too far.  This is a great way to prevent  the build-up of  bad feelings and resentments  and retains loyal  members--always a good thing.

Quote from: TrlrboyAs to people posting, the content of the posts is what is important to me, not the number of posts a person has.

yes, thank God we have finally moved beyond the little popup icons and the numbers game!  :W

PS--are you SURE you dont work for the Texas Chamber of Commerce?  Great  pics of the Texas State Parks in your albums (My fave is the one of Ginger helping you drive, though  ;) )
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Post by: tlhdoc on Feb 15, 2004, 07:27 AM
I think things are slow here because there are very few new people on the board that stay past the free trial period.  With out the new people the board slows way down, as it slows down people that have paid don't visit as often and it slows down even more.  To get new people to join and stay PUT needs to offer something the free sites don't.  Otherwise people will not pay for what the can get for free elsewhere.  The free subscription to the magazine is a start, but there needs to be more.
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Post by: cruiserpop on Feb 15, 2004, 07:36 AM
Why the biblical wailing and gnaching of teeth? Dave picked a business model for his enterprise (and it is his enterprise). He happens to be fufilling a larger social need (and thank you for that), but he needs to keep the concern going with some kind of income stream. My suggesgtion-push the magazine angle, advertise like heck, and add the board as an afterthought. another option, consider what the biggest draw is-the classifides. consider turning around the setup-turn the forum on fro viewing by the general publuc-require a small fee or joining to post a unit for sale. Or turn it all on, and ask for donations to keep it going. a hunting board i frequent uses this model, and goes along nicely.
another option-hit all the major manufacturers hard to put a sanctoned forum, or link to sanctioned forum on the site, etc. I'm shure dave et all have probobly hashed through all these options ad nauseum. but it is his baby to sweat. Me, i ain't goin nowheres...Pass the bottle, and the popcorn. the campfire's nice tonight, and the company is great.
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Post by: forestwalker on Feb 15, 2004, 08:16 AM
I suggest combining the General Forum,Product Reviews,and Mr. Fix It under the title of, "General Forum".Then the General Forum would be enriched,and posts concerning product reviews,repairs,and modifications would probably reach many more readers.More responses are likely to follow.
PS-We love Pop Up Times,and the Board Too !
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Post by: topcat7736 on Feb 15, 2004, 10:52 AM
Strange how things turn out. DNO (Dean) almost never posted on the last Snitz forum but does plenty of it now on his own board. He even became a member of THIS board in October!

Folks post their ads here because it's FREE. On DNO's site, they must PAY to advertise, so very few do. I guess supporting that board with their $$ isn't worth it because there's a FREE place to go instead!

I subscribe to this board and to 'The Magazine' because I like them both....and I like Dave. I send people we meet at campgrounds and people asking about popups HERE. As far as I'm concerned, there isn't any other place I want to be. Dave, the innovator, created that which others now copy. And, ours is a troll FREE environment. Makes for less stress and more quality reading.

From my perspective, I'd much rather be with the best than the rest. Count me in on staying with Dave!
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Post by: Gone-Camping on Feb 15, 2004, 10:53 AM
We all knew that once the Pay system went into effect, the new members joining the board were going to drop way off. Yes, with the help of admin and the "free trial" period and the other sections open to anyone, this board has been able to pull in some new "paying" people. But when you compare it to the amount of people signing up on other boards, this one pale's in comparison. It's just going to be, it'll be hard for new comers to shell out money just to ask if they need to put their stabilizers down first or afterwards! And that is where much of the traffic comes from, is new users asking old questions, and old users giving old advice!

Be that as it may, we will have to accept the fact this is a PAY site, and as such will never be what it once was. As for the threads in the other boards, you may notice that I generally don't get involved with those issues. And as the sole Moderator over at HYX, I'll have my eye on anything that looks like it's bashing another site (this one, or any other one).
 
As for staying with this one, that is a loaded question too. I paid initially to see what I'd get for my money, so far I'm not really disappointed, but I have noticed the drop-off, and have to really think if it's worth another year. Adding the magazine subscription to the deal helps with that decision a great deal!!!
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Post by: dee106 on Feb 15, 2004, 11:30 AM
it's true, i post more now because i'm involded with the eastern rally, and i'm trying to keep that going, feed back is very slow, my concerns have been were to post things, i think general and campfire could be brought back together, and reviews and bargans of products can be put together, we are spreading out to much, hard to keep talking when you have to go here and there.
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Post by: birol on Feb 15, 2004, 01:41 PM
I think Campfire should be kept seperate from the general, as we do a lot of off topic discussions there, but the different camping region discussions might be a possibility if you ask me. before I was shooed away from Nick-Neff-Cough area, I was amazed how busy that forum was.

Just an idea, don't shoot me.
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Post by: B-flat on Feb 15, 2004, 04:09 PM
Birol, when were you shooed away from NNC? I read a lot of their posts in the camping forums....
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Post by: calstate360 on Feb 15, 2004, 05:05 PM
Quote from: birolI think Campfire should be kept seperate from the general, as we do a lot of off topic discussions there, but the different camping region discussions might be a possibility if you ask me. before I was shooed away from Nick-Neff-Cough area, I was amazed how busy that forum was.
 
Just an idea, don't shoot me.
Briol no one shooed you away! Perhaps you misinterpeted our strange sense of humor.
Heck we would never chase anyone away, if they can put up with us maniacs they have to be ok.:D
Sal
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Post by: NightOwl on Feb 15, 2004, 05:59 PM
Quote from: calstate360Briol no one shooed you away! Perhaps you misinterpeted our strange sense of humor.
Heck we would never chase anyone away, if they can put up with us maniacs they have to be ok.:D
Sal

CalState--so glad to see you say this and re-assure Birol.  When I saw what he wrote, my eyebrows went up into my hairline in amazement because I just knew that somehow he had misunderstoodf something.  After all these years of you and Sacto and Y-Guy (in the past) and the others, I've concluded that your gang is the wackiest, most fun, warm and welcoming group ever to be found in any campground, cyber or real-time!

(And besides, I simply cant imagine anyone wanting to mistreat someone like Birol who is such a loyal and caring friend to all of us and such a  cheerful companion on the board no matter how many obstacles he is facing in his daily life.  I KNEW this is something none of the Cal group would ever be guilty of and now Birol surely must  be certain of this, too.) :S
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Post by: byrdr1 on Feb 15, 2004, 06:27 PM
Well to respond or not?

I have continued with this forum after the change because I supported Dave and his move to pay for view. I have camped with lots of you atg Townsend and I had a great time. this was the first place I found when I got my popup. I have enjoyed the forum and the folks. But now here I am over 3 years later. I have camped so many times I cant remember. I have learned alot here. I have also moved to the dark side (love it or leave it). I made mods just like alot of folks and started my own web site with camping pictures and stuff about my family and me. So I still drop in now and then just as i do on PUX. I read the HYX forum because alot of posts are more in line with a TT. I spend a lot of time at RV.Net. They are looking at support right now.. Posts are up and they are looking for advertisements also. SO with growth comes problems.. Too much band width, volume etc.
The lack of posts well  I dont know....But with PUX you do get free access and can post all you want and most of the newbies are there. Will I continue after my time runs out I dont know??????Only have another month. The PUT mag does not meet my needs at this time. So I will not be renewing, not because I dont like it or it is thin, just because... I will post as long as I can and if I leave I am still on PUX and rv.net for any advise on TT camping.
I hope Dave and PUT keeps going and going, going....
Randy
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Post by: Ab Diver on Feb 15, 2004, 06:49 PM
Quote from: birolbefore I was shooed away from Nick-Neff-Cough area, I was amazed how busy that forum was.

We would NEVER *shoo* anyone away. We always use two shoos.
 
 
QuoteJust an idea, don't shoot me.

Ah, that's the problem.... when you spell it, you have to add the silent *T* and it looks like it has an all-together different meaning. I don't blame you-- I'd have run for cover as well. Don't worry, most of our members are terrible shots. ;)
 
All kidding aside: Birol, you are always Welcome at our campfires, both real and virtual.
 
 
 
 
Nick-Neff-Cough.... if I gotta e'splane it, you wouldn't understand. Hehehehe...
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Post by: birol on Feb 15, 2004, 06:54 PM
My sense of humor, before it gets someone mad, I wasn't shooed away, I left on my own as my sense of humor and theirs did not match :):):) So rather then bore them to death and be a thread killer, I stopped posting there, they are a lovely bunch in that forum !

Sorry for the off topic post, but had to clear it out.

Quote from: calstate360Briol no one shooed you away! Perhaps you misinterpeted our strange sense of humor.
Heck we would never chase anyone away, if they can put up with us maniacs they have to be ok.:D
Sal
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Post by: NightOwl on Feb 15, 2004, 08:55 PM
Quote from: birolSorry for the off topic post, but had to clear it out.

Birol, you can hi-jack one of my campfire threads any time you want! :W

It is great that people are thinking about what the board means to them and  how it might work for us in the future and that they are sharing their thoughts here.  Sometimes it is good to stop and take stock.  Seems like there are times when we take the good things in life for granted and this board may be one of them.
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Post by: B-flat on Feb 15, 2004, 09:11 PM
Hehehe, I love the entertainment provided on their forum at NNC.:D  I also want to add that they have a wonderful website, too, with plenty of information.
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Post by: gsm x2 on Feb 15, 2004, 09:36 PM
As far as the apparent demise of PUT.  I still don't think so.  Every now and again I wander into the PUX and the popup section of IRV.  I haven't been there for a while, but those forums don't seem to be exceptionally busier that PUT.

What PUT has going for it is a real magazine, the fact that Dave and his crew truly support the Pop-up Communiity, and that this is the forum that has Rallies.  When we have to renew in a few months, we will renew and receive the magazine as part of the deal.

Anyone can attract a crowd by giving away FREE....experience the lines when gas stations kick back prices to 50 cents a gallon.  It takes a quality product to charge for services in a free market.

Birol---you're welcome to post in the NNC forum whenever you want.
gsm x2
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Post by: OC Campers on Feb 15, 2004, 11:20 PM
I am probably one of those people that Nightowl talks about.  My
husband and I have been members of PUT since we got our PU in
2001.  When we first joined we were so new to popup camping
that we gobbled up any info we could get and answered many posts.
Unfortutely, now that we know what we are doing the need to post isn't like it used to be.  But I do want to say that if it wasn't for the wonderful people on this board, we probably would of sold the camper and went back to tent camping.
 
I have to admit, the main reason I look at the board daily is to keep up with SC Campers and NNC.  I will look at the General and Campfire forums but most of the posts are for technical issues or for other areas that I know nothing about.   I do also enjoy the recipe forum.  I have gotten a lot of
great recipes from it.  I have also posted a few of my favorites there
too.  
 
I do not know how to go about getting more people to post and I think the way the forums are listed is fine the way they are.  I like having the general and campfire separate because I know I can always find some light hearted post to make me laugh under the campfire heading.
 
I also know that I will continue to pay for PUT.  I think it is a
valuable site and have met many people that I otherwise would
of never met.  Dave even flew out to go to one of our NNC rally's
last June.  He is a great person who really cares about the popup
campers.  He has put his all into PUT and I will continue to support
his efforts.
Jacqui
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Post by: angelsmom10 on Feb 16, 2004, 07:42 AM
When we got our first PU in 2001, I searched the internet for information as neither of us ever owned a PU...(DH has always wanted a trailer, and I wanted a PU and when the opportunity arose for a very inexpensive PU... we jumped on it and DH now says he would always have a PU...so much nicer.)
 
Anyways.....searching the internet, there was a wealth of information out there along with message boards.  I did a lot of searching and found that PUT seemed the best... there was a comadery (spelling???) among the members and there was a wealth of information.. questions could be repeated and answers were given freely... last year, this issue came up about the board dying and I started with a general question about PU-ing and people told me to just do a search.... I knew the answer, I wanted to just start things with general questions hoping to get different responses and NOT  --- do a search.  When we just joined, I know questions were repeated asked, but it kept the interest going and always received at least 1 new idea (if not more) as new members came and people tried different things.
 
We met most of our camping friends from GLPUC here on PUT... most of them have left as they did not want to pay.  We wanted to remain loyal to Dave as it was his original site and magazine that gave us the love for our PU.  With DH out of unemployment, when our membership runs out, we are being forced to leave here; except for the forums that will allow non-paying members.  This is very emotional for me and I do wish PUT and it's current members the best hope that the site does not die... everyone keep it going and start topics about the basics of PU's...DO's and DON'Ts... what to look for.... how to's....
 
Everyone enter your input and don't just answer with ...."this has been discussed before and do a search" or whatever similar responses that have been posted in the past..
 
 
 
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Post by: NightOwl on Feb 16, 2004, 09:00 AM
Quote from: topcat7736Strange how things turn out. DNO (Dean) almost never posted on the last Snitz forum but does plenty of it now on his own board. He even became a member of THIS board in October!

Folks post their ads here because it's FREE. On DNO's site, they must PAY to advertise, so very few do. I guess supporting that board with their $$ isn't worth it because there's a FREE place to go instead!

I subscribe to this board and to 'The Magazine' because I like them both....and I like Dave. I send people we meet at campgrounds and people asking about popups HERE. As far as I'm concerned, there isn't any other place I want to be. Dave, the innovator, created that which others now copy. And, ours is a troll FREE environment. Makes for less stress and more quality reading.

From my perspective, I'd much rather be with the best than the rest. Count me in on staying with Dave!

As much as it pains me to agree with a sibling :eek: , I have to say that Al makes a lot of sense.

It is really great to see all the good ideas people are expressing here  :)

And I  hope that other members  will add their  candid thoughts as well.  :W
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Post by: Camperroo on Feb 16, 2004, 09:16 AM
This forum was the very first forum I joined 4 years ago when I first got on the internet and then had bought a popup camper.  I remember when Cajun was the king on this board (I mean that in a respectful sense) he offered so much information it was unbelievable along with many others.  I've watched the board go through a ton of changes.  

Dave has a small business he's trying to grow and has a right to charge for access to the board.  Others have the option of deciding if it is really one more thing they can afford in their budget.  $30.00 may not sound like a lot, in most instances it isn't.  But even in my case where DH lost his job and is luckily working again...I don't know if I can as easily dole out the money for the board when I realize it's an extravagance I can easily get at another forum for free.  Except...I happen to like this board and am more comfortable here than elsewhere.  I'd like to see the board become part of the magaziine fee or open it up again as a free board but advertise the heck out of the magazine. I wouldn't mind a few Pop Up Times pop up ads appear in the discussion forums as you now see in the rv.net forum.  That way the name is always around somewhere for someone to pick up on and hopefully subscribe to the mag.  There's no easy answer.  You just have to do what's right by you and your pocketbook as does Dave.
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Post by: campingboaters on Feb 16, 2004, 09:19 AM
Why I stay with PUT...
 
I had been on the other sites a while ago, but found the people there VERY rude, so I never check in to some of the other sites anymore.  When I ask a question, it's OBVIOUSLY because I don't know the answer.  Some people on the other sites would rather belittle me than give me an answer or just not answer me at all.  You don't get that here.  This is a GREAT group of cyber-friends.  And while I've never actually met any of you, I still consider you friends and a GREAT source of information.  My non-cyber camping friends always think I'm weird that I found things out on this site -- I say it so often.  You'd THINK they would just hook them selves up here and find out how wonderful everyone is and how much information is to be had!  I can only do so much to help them!  ;)
 
Unfortunately, most people are driven by the almighty dollar.  That is why it's "slower" here versus PUX.  To me, PUX has TOO much of the same thing going on everyday.  I come here for the peace, the quiet and the occassional (more often than not) laugh.
 
Even though I now own a hybrid (pop-out) instead of a Pop-up, I'll re-new my membership to keep visiting here.  It's a nice break in my day -- catching up on all that is going on.  I'll even try to post more often. :D
 
What to do to improve things?  I think there are way too many forums.  I tend not to check certain "rally" forums because I feel like an outsider.  Some threads go on for hundreds of responses and it's just too hard for me to keep up with what's going on when.  Maybe we could limit the number of responses one thread can have?  
 
Also, instead of regions for campground reviews, could there be a way to select a state only.  I think IRV2 has that type of setup for campground reviews.  I found it easier to see campground reviews listed by campground for just the state I wanted to go camping.  Having to read most of the post just to find out what campground it is or where it's located is tough.  If we can't change the format, can we just make everyone enter the campground name, location and if it's a review or question in the subject line?
 
Just a thought or two.
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Post by: MtnCamper on Feb 16, 2004, 09:46 AM
Well, I might just as well add my two cents too. I'm all over on the net, I follow about 5 boards, but don't post a lot to all of them. Each board has it's own personality. Which is good. Each board has it's own advantages (and disadvantages), But I camp in all of them. And I will probably continue to. So you guys will just have to put up with me.

As far as all the forums, It's for convenience. You can go look at the forum where you know the thread will be. Rallies, or Camping Clubs or Recipes. It's not the number of forums that keeps the membership low. It's just the way people are, some don't want to pay for the board, when free is available. But if the other boards charged $31.50, This board would be swamped again. It's the same reason you drive around the block a couple times to buy gas 2 cents cheaper. When the total cost savings, really doesn't justify the action. I know people that go to 3 or 4 different grocery stores, and buy just the special priced items at each one. They spend all day doing it. How much is your time and effort worth, or better how much do you enjoy this board? Ask yourself if it's worth the cost......... I bet it is.
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Post by: wiininkwe on Feb 16, 2004, 03:19 PM
I've been following this thread wanting to post to it, but not sure just what I could say to express how I feel.  This morning DH and I were cleaning out some desk drawers and I came across something that I wrote and emailed to ladies Home Journal magazine almost exactly a year ago.   They had featured a new type of forum and I was hoping to get to have my 'thoughts' published in it.  (No, it never happened, but we can dream, can't we?)  Anyway, I hope you don't mind, it's kinda of...no, make that, quite...long but I'm going to paste it here so you can see how I feel.    Remember, I wrote this a year ago.
 
Connections
Title: the rest of the story
Post by: wiininkwe on Feb 16, 2004, 03:22 PM
Okay, here's the end.  Sorry about it being so long.
 
At one point just recently, the message board was host to over 4,000 members, and the logistics of running a website that large got to be very problematic. The owner of the site decided to go to a
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Post by: Nick on Feb 16, 2004, 03:31 PM
Quote from: birolI think Campfire should be kept seperate from the general, as we do a lot of off topic discussions there, but the different camping region discussions might be a possibility if you ask me. before I was shooed away from Nick-Neff-Cough area, I was amazed how busy that forum was.
 
Just an idea, don't shoot me.
Birol,
As the nnc moderator your always welcome at our forum.....  If you were shooed away, shoo yourself back over. :D
Title: What else do you want?
Post by: Popupper on Feb 16, 2004, 04:34 PM
$30 for a forum and a magazine that gives so much to pop up camping is a deal. I don't want to pay more but I'll keep paying $30 for this.
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Post by: rccs on Feb 16, 2004, 07:55 PM
I agree with many of you that there are a few less posts here than there used to be. I believe it is mainly because of the fact that the people here are no longer competing to see how many little trailers they could get under their name like before. I think many of those who used to compete for the numbers have moved to other boards. I seen just the other day that someone on PUX (not mentioning his name) had been congradulated for the number of posts he had attained.
I check out this board just about every day and there seems to be something new every time I log on, granted there may be a little less than before. I plan on staying here also. I don't mind paying to use this site because of the fact that there are so many friendly people here. This was the first board I found on the internet that had anything to do with popup camping and I enjoy it very much.  KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK DAVE!
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Post by: Gone-Camping on Feb 16, 2004, 08:55 PM
Well, you may not have got published in the Ladies Home Journal, but somehow I suspect with a story like that, you'll get published in PUT...soon?!?!
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Post by: B-flat on Feb 16, 2004, 10:20 PM
wii, that's a beautiful story about your experiences from beginning to the present with PUT.  It echoes the same feelings I have. :)
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Post by: LKaskel on Feb 16, 2004, 10:47 PM
It's easy to see there are no simple answers!  In my opinion it comes down to the (LCD) lowest common denominator....MONEY.  We all have our own priorities on how we spend it but for most of us (I understand not all) we will spend $30 or more on all kind of things that have short term enjoyment and not much of a redeming value.  I'll give some examples...a night at the movies for a family of 4 or 5, dinner at Pizza Hut, all the extra pay channels on cable or satellite each month not to mention the extra money we spend at Walmart when we really went for "one thing".  $30 for one years worth of PUT and access to this board should not be a discussion.  Dave is doing a great job delivering a magazine for us and suppling this site which cost more money than he makes from it.  I look at it this way...I feel like I'm just thankful for what I get for one year at the cost of one dozen steamed crabs in Maryland.  The enjoyment I get reading this board is by far worth it!
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Post by: Miss-Teri on Feb 17, 2004, 08:11 AM
Very well said, Toni.
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Post by: NightOwl on Feb 17, 2004, 09:02 AM
See, it's things like Toni wrote that PUT makes room for.  She expressed beautifully what has happened on this board over the years we have been together!  

We KNOW  we have  the freedom to express ourselves here  OPENLY  without fear of ridicule, and knowing that others will  provide moral support if we need it when we face tough times such as Mike4947's tragic loss of his wife, or the Mahaffey boys going off to war, or jpreiser's Chemo.  And we all share in the good things as well, like the story of a DD going to a first long trip away from home, or tales of DD off to her very  first "Big Dance."  (And we all just HAD to see the pictures of this event!)  This is the first website I joined, and since have joined others, but  I have never seen another "subject based" forum where people do this kind of thing, not even the arts or fitness forums I belong to..

The atmosphere here is uniquely  family-like and this openess is what makes this place worth $30. per year for me, and as I mentioned in an  earlier post, I have never been sorry I continued on, even at a time when Dave took a lot of heat for charging for the board.   Like others have said, we set our own priorities for how we spend our money, and this one year subscription costs less than a night out at the movies for a small family.  (And at least what we see HERE is DEPENDABLY  fit for family consumption.)  :)
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Post by: Preacher on Feb 17, 2004, 01:12 PM
I'm one of those that doesn't post very much, but I do read what is going on.  I've been with PUT for a while now.  I go back to the Cajun and Flyfisherman days of several boards ago!  I've found that what Solomon wrote is very true, "There is nothing new under the sun."  Most of the questions I read are the same ones I asked many years ago.  I have time under my belt and fewer questions now.  The things I am most interested in are the campground reviews.  As my wife and I plan vacations, I want to know what experiences people have had in various CG's.

However, just because I have very few questions, or answer very few of the questions asked (because someone usually answers them before I see them) doesn't mean I don't enjoy this site.  I still enjoy the excitement I see in the writings of those new campers.  I takes me back to my first days of camping in a PU.  There are also really no new SPUTs, but as I read about them I have to laugh as I remember doing the same things.  But then there are those times that there is something new and that makes this site even more worth while.  Yes I'm a member of many other camping sites, some of them longer than I've been with PUT, but I keep coming back to this one and keep reading the magazine.  I figure if I get just one good idea, or one good laugh every few months or so, then it is worth the money. Just the thoughts of a preacher.
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Post by: kimrb266 on Feb 17, 2004, 01:50 PM
We joined PUT last summer as we were shopping for our first PU.  We found valuable information about PU's and even located a local dealer, another PUT's member posted info about how happy they were, we bought it and have gone on two trips with members.
 
I seldon post but I enjoy checking out the various topics and info on a regular basis.  I have checked our PUX and found the info being posted is almost the same, I haven't found much elsewhere that hasn't been posted here.
 
The main reason I don't post in the general or campfire area is because I'm not much into "internet conversations", call me old fashioned, but for those that enjoy posting regularly I think its great.
 
I also like the camping forums and area rallys, I'm looking forward to 2 upcomming camping trips with felow PUT'ers. :)
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Post by: angelsmom10 on Feb 17, 2004, 02:12 PM
I'm one right up there with birol with posts mainly in the campfire section. I do not really like to post my opinions in the CG Review as that is really one's person taste. When we first got our PU, we camped at a SP very near us as since our DD's were teens and really never alone in the house for any length of time, we wanted to be close..."just in case" although MIL lives within a few miles of our house. We totally enjoy this CG and camp there quite frequently. About our 2nd or 3rd trip with a group, we were talking about CG's and we brought up this CG and one of the other people really downed us and the CG saying how terrible it was and how the trash cans in the bathrooms NEVER got emptied (the time they had discussed happened to be over a holiday weekend and also, who stands in the bathroom looking at the trash overflowing). I just felt so out of place and put down because we loved this CG and this person made such a to-do about how bad this CG really is. Since it is a matter of opinion, I just don't like to express myself very often because it is like...beauty is in the eye of the beholder. How often are you in the bathroom anyway...as long as we don't have "pit" bathrooms, I could care less.
 
 
By the way, this happens to be the CG that we have taken the teens to for the past 3yrs and they have not had a bit of trouble or complaints about it. In fact one of the guys we always have to tease as when we camp, he gets upset when a fly lands on his plate or sandwich and has to either turn the plate around or even pick off the piece of bread that the fly lands on... by the end of the weekend, he's in with the crowd and lets it go about the fly landing on his plate or sandwich. We do try to keep the area clean and set up a screen tent to keep the flies to a minimum, but you're camping what do you expect.  I guess this part will explain a lot... he had never camped in his life till 3yrs ago when he went with us.... he talked about the great time he had and his parents decided to get a motorhome (he says it's not very big). Apparently they just did this last spring and we asked him to find out when his parents wanted to camp or if they even wanted to join us last year when we took the teens out and his response.... we only got the motorhome to travel on vacation they drive it to the hotel and stay there (in the hotel)... did not get it to camp in:confused: ...what's the point was our response.
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Post by: 2manytoyz on Feb 17, 2004, 06:30 PM
Oh, you've opened Pandora's Box now!

Honestly, the magazine is a fair price.  It is thin, but I have been buying it for years as it is a niche market.  The forum is overpriced.  It's twice that of the magazine ($14.98 vs. $30 yr.).  In the magazine, research was done, articles were printed, and it was mailed to me.  With the website, I read articles from other paying members.  The only thing provided was access to the forum.  This same type of service is provided elsewhere for free.  Those are the facts.

Now, I want to say I've always loved this forum.  Great folks, fun stories.  However, if the access wasn't included with the subscription renewal, I wouldn't be here now.  Some of the stories posted on the forum end up in the magazine.  I have no problem with that if the forum was free, but having to pay to post stories that will make money for the magazine doesn't seem ethical to me.

I can fully appreciate that websites and bandwidth cost money.  I run several websites myself.  I have no advertisement, no banners, and make no money from them.  Judging by the number of posts here, bandwidth isn't an issue.

I would recommend to Dave and staff that they seriously lower the cost of access to the forum.  Make it a package deal with the magazine.  1 years access to both for $20.  If you feature someone's story, give them a free access for a year.  That would be incentive for some of us to send you technical articles.   ;)

JMHO.  YMMV.
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Post by: garym053 on Feb 17, 2004, 07:10 PM
I have checked PUX and some of the other Pop-Up sites about 4 times in the last 6 months. I like PUT, both the board & the mag, and I'm here to stay. I like reading all your posts whether On Topic or OFF. It would be great to actually meet you all camping some day, although there's probably a pretty slim chance of that happening!

I'm not sure anything needs to be done TOO differently to attract new members. SOME change is usually good, although I don't see Drastic changes being needed. I agree with those who would like to see the Campfire section kept separate for Off Topic posts. That's the FIRST section I check! Then I check the Northeast Campground section, although with 20 to 30 below temps, very few of us up here in Northern New England are thinking of camping just now! Paying the oil bill ($1.60 / Gallon) is more important than making reservations! Then I check the Fix It section, Product Reviews, Polls, and Lastly the General section.

I hope all those considering not renewing change their minds, simply because I (and others, I'm sure) value your posts. Remember that (especially with the Magazine Subscription included), it doesn't take many rebates from the PUT store to pay for your subscription!
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Post by: Used 2B PopUPTimes on Feb 17, 2004, 08:42 PM
Quote from: 2manytoyzI would recommend to Dave and staff that they seriously lower the cost of access to the forum.  Make it a package deal with the magazine.  1 years access to both for $20.  If you feature someone's story, give them a free access for a year.  That would be incentive for some of us to send you technical articles.   ;)

JMHO.  YMMV.

Good ideas

Charlie and I had a conversation today about lowering the price to $20 for both, now that we have our internet expenses under control.
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Post by: NightOwl on Feb 17, 2004, 10:02 PM
Quote from: PopUPTimesGood ideas

Charlie and I had a conversation today about lowering the price to $20 for both, now that we have our internet expenses under control.

 :S This is SUPER news, Dave.  For one thing, it means the magazine and the board are on solid footing, and for another, it will be  a big help to your loyal readers with tight budgets in these challenging economic times!   What a great morale builder for all of us.   :S  :W
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Post by: MtnCamper on Feb 17, 2004, 10:30 PM
Quote from: NightOwl:S This is SUPER news, Dave.  For one thing, it means the magazine and the board are on solid footing, and for another, it will be  a big help to your loyal readers with tight budgets in these challenging economic times!   What a great morale builder for all of us.   :S  :W
Does that mean it's going to happen, or we are just talking about it? :confused:
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Post by: B-flat on Feb 17, 2004, 10:39 PM
That is good news and if it does work out it will be appreciated by many. :)
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Post by: NightOwl on Feb 18, 2004, 05:31 AM
Quote from: MtnCamperDoes that mean it's going to happen, or we are just talking about it? :confused:

My GUESS is that this is probably going to happen since Dave is not a shoot-from-the-hip kind of guy (like some of us. :eek:  ;)  )   He strikes me as the sort  of person who would not make a remark like this unless he was quite certain of being able to follow through on it.  

Actually, I am not surprised at the new rates he has proposed.  He made it clear from the beginning that did he NOT institute these fees to make a profit, but rather,  because the huge board we used to have was really costing big bucks  :(   and was turning out to be a financial drain rather than a useful  adjunct to the magazine.

If  this works out as he mentions, we are all in for a fantastic bargain :W
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Post by: whitestar505 on Feb 18, 2004, 05:40 AM
All,

 
  All I have to say is give me the bill and let's get on with life. Life is to short and I rather be camping...
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Post by: NightOwl on Feb 18, 2004, 06:08 AM
Quote from: whitestar505All,

 
  All I have to say is give me the bill and let's get on with life. Life is to short and I rather be camping...

Not everyone has a lot of disposable income right now, so this information means more to some of us than it does to others.  Believe it or not, there are actually  people who cant afford "the bill" for both the magazine and the board right now (about $50.00 annually)  so I imagine they will be very pleased with new rates.  

And THEN we will all get on with life and  go camping!   :)  (Well, as soon as the weather is decent  ;) )
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Post by: Used 2B PopUPTimes on Feb 18, 2004, 06:49 AM
Quote from: NightOwlNot everyone has a lot of disposable income right now, so this information means more to some of us than it does to others.  Believe it or not, there are actually  people who cant afford "the bill" for both the magazine and the board right now (about $50.00 annually)  so I imagine they will be very pleased with new rates.  

And THEN we will all get on with life and  go camping!   :)  (Well, as soon as the weather is decent  ;) )

We've included the magazine as part of membership since last summer, currently $30 gets you both. We mailed out store credits to those who paid for the magazine and the Arvee Club. Most members/subscribers have redeemed their credits for stuff in the store.

We're carefully considering several ideas to boost both the magazine's circulation and the Arvee Club's traffic. We still remember the traffic jams that we had several years ago that "slammed" us with expensive internet fees and constant moderation of a handful of trouble makers. We read every post and have had very little moderation intervention.
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Post by: birol on Feb 18, 2004, 06:55 AM
So, the cost will be 20 US (is that 20 Canadian for canadians ?) to get the magazine and access the forum ? Or is that 20 bucks each ? (Sorry for asking a dumb question)
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Post by: NightOwl on Feb 18, 2004, 07:26 AM
Quote from: PopUPTimesWe've included the magazine as part of membership since last summer, currently $30 gets you both. We mailed out store credits to those who paid for the magazine and the Arvee Club. Most members/subscribers have redeemed their credits for stuff in the store.

We're carefully considering several ideas to boost both the magazine's circulation and the Arvee Club's traffic. We still remember the traffic jams that we had several years ago that "slammed" us with expensive internet fees and constant moderation of a handful of trouble makers. We read every post and have had very little moderation intervention.



Sorry, Dave,  I must be  stuck in a time warp with the original figures where we paid for the magazine and then paid for the board on top of it--somehow I missed the announcement of the "combination" of fees.  

As several of us have commented in the past, the trolls are not missed and  the newer, smaller board is much faster, as well as dependably pleasant.
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Post by: Trlrboy on Feb 18, 2004, 02:57 PM
Quote from: PopUPTimesCharlie and I had a conversation today about lowering the price to $20 for both, now that we have our internet expenses under control.
Give this man a round of applause.  Anytime you get a 33% cost reduction nowadays you have really done something.
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Post by: Garrett on Feb 18, 2004, 03:24 PM
Did I miss something.  All I saw is they had a conversation about lowering the price. My DW and i have a lot of conversations but that sure does not make something a done deal.  So let's clarify this.  What is the renwal price????
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Post by: MtnCamper on Feb 18, 2004, 03:27 PM
Quote from: MtnCamperDoes that mean it's going to happen, or we are just talking about it? :confused:
Back to my question, That's the same way I read it.....
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Post by: NightOwl on Feb 18, 2004, 05:20 PM
MntnCamper  if I am wrong about this, I will personally pay for YOUR membership renewal, but having met Dave in person and having talked to him on the phone at length a number of times, my sense of the man is that he would NEVER mention a price if he were not prepared to put that amount on the bottom line.  He is very cautious,  a straight-shooter, and doesnt  say things until he knows what he is getting himself into.

I just cannot believe he would mention his conversation with Charlie unless he could be sure that the price he mentioned is what it is going to actually be.

JMHO, and if I'm wrong, Gary gets a year of the board and the magazine as my guest :J
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Post by: MtnCamper on Feb 18, 2004, 05:29 PM
I am reasonably sure also. But I'm just the kind of guy that wants to make sure. I also make store honor their tags on the shevles....... Or sell me the second at the same price the first is marked. (hint) look in the rear of the shelf. :rolleyes:
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Post by: MommaMia on Feb 18, 2004, 05:31 PM
Quote from: NightOwlJMHO, and if I'm wrong, Gary gets a year of the board and the magazine as my guest :J


And she means it too!  I KNOW!!! ;)
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Post by: SactoCampers on Feb 18, 2004, 09:13 PM
I've finally had a chance to read through all of the posts.

 
First, Birol, I get your humor! ;)
 
Two, all the compliments paid to Dave are accurate. A real genuine nice person.
 
Three, reducing the price to board access and is a great idea. I don't know how many it will bring back. But I don't really care either. This group is great, and while I don't get the opportunity to check it (or participate) as often as I used to, I know I don't have to wade through pages of posts to catch up.
 
There is something special about PUT. There always has been and likely always will be. And even though I just purchased a little hybrid, I will still be here.
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Post by: gsm x2 on Feb 18, 2004, 09:41 PM
$20.00 for the magazine and access to the Board....sounds like a great deal to me.  I'll wait for the official announcement.
 
But for contributing to the magazine...give me the T-shirt.  I love saying, "I'm a published author and I have the T-shirt to prove it."  :J
 
gsm x2
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Post by: NightOwl on Feb 19, 2004, 06:28 PM
I've been reading back through all  the posts in this thread and  find everyone's remarks enlightening and  thoughtful.  And something very good has happened here.  Yes, I know the plan for the revised fee schedule is "something very good" but I actually had another "something very good" in mind.  And it is this:

If Dave ever felt that we took him, the magazine, and/or  the board for granted, he has  learned the past day or two that we  place great value on our own unique "trinity" (remember, we were once called a "cult" ;)  )

It is still winter, the weather in many parts of the country is drab, we are gettihng antsy, but that hasnt kept us from gathering here regularly, from reading every word in the magazine,  or from appreciating the hard work Dave and  his merry band of helpers all put into the board and the magazine.  He certainly ought to be convinced after our  candid, coast to coast  assessments of the "new board" that we do not lack afrfection or gratitude.  And the news that he will continue "this place" as well as the magazine ought to cheer all of us as we await the arrival of Spring :W  :S

Funny--I DO actually  think of this board as a REAL PLACE.  Do some of the rest of you do this?
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Post by: MommaMia on Feb 19, 2004, 10:21 PM
Quote from: NightOwlFunny--I DO actually  think of this board as a REAL PLACE.  Do some of the rest of you do this?


I know I sure do.  Sometimes, though, I catch myself talking to a friend or family member about one thing or another and I'll mention a friend or a tip from PUT, and I'll quickly explain that it's a magazine and online forum that I belong to.  Well, I can't tell you how many odd looks I have gotten.  The whole conversation comes to a screeching halt with me ending up taking the next 10 mins to explain my "involvement" with an online forum.  Some people get it, or at least tell me they do.  Others look at me like I just told them that I am going on a cruise with Anna Nicole next week!  Sometimes I end up feeling all flustered, like I got caught dressing up in Star Trek outfits or something! (disclaimer... not intended to offend any present Trekkies... I just couldn't ever explain it to my family if I were to dress up.  I have no problem with you dressing up!)  It seems some just don't get that you can have a real and meaningful relationship with people you have never met face to face.  One thing that seems to make bridging the connection gap a little easier is to show them your pictures from the rallies you have all been to.  Makes it more real.
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Post by: griffsmom on Feb 19, 2004, 10:47 PM
Quote from: birolMy sense of humor, before it gets someone mad, I wasn't shooed away, I left on my own as my sense of humor and theirs did not match :):):) So rather then bore them to death and be a thread killer, I stopped posting there, they are a lovely bunch in that forum !
 
Sorry for the off topic post, but had to clear it out.
Birol, I, too, have been accused of being a thread killer by my brothuhs and Haha sistuhs at NNC.  Don't let them kid you--it takes real power and wits to shut that bunch up.  Thread-killing is a badge of honor and distinction, not a mark of shame, and as everyone knows...
 
 
WE DON'T NEED ANY STINKIN' BADGES! :D
 
 
But seriously, please don't be put off by our RR-ing--you (and anyone else who can take the heat ;) ) are welcome in our neck of the woods any time. :)
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Post by: B-flat on Feb 19, 2004, 11:10 PM
....and I'm bringing a whole Bluegrass Band. ;)  :D  :eek:  :cool:  :J
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Post by: copcarguy on Feb 20, 2004, 12:09 AM
Hey all!!

I just read through the past seven pages and I am glad someone brought this topic up...  Several fellow PUT'ers and I were sitting around a campfire this past season and we were discussing this very thing.  Yes, I do feel like PUT has lost some of the "magic" from when I first became involved here nearly four years ago.  Do I post as much as I used to??  No...  Do I have a reason??  I'm not really sure to be 100% honest.  It has nothing to do with paying to write this post, for as far as I'm concerned, PUT has given me & my family priceless help, advice, information, new places to visit, and of course camping FRIENDS!!  I have made friends here that I cherish.  I will continue to be here just for that reason.  We even started a camping club COTOC thanks to Dave and PUT bringing us all together.  I am also thankful that there is a COTOC section here at PUT!  We have several events planned for this year already...    
 
I guess for me what made some of the "magic" fade away was with how the information that PUT was going to charge a fee was presented to us here on the board.  Here's my point of view:  We attended the PUT Rally in Sept 2002 at Eagles Peak CG in PA.  We were one of the first families to arrive, and we got our "own site".  The CG staff advised us that "we were lucky to get a single site"...  To make a long story short, some people that signed up for the rally were stacked two families to a site!!  Dave showed up later that evening and really went to bat for us PUT'ers...  An enjoyable weekend was ensured for all despite this oversight, and I can honestly say that Dave gave 110% to make everyone happy - even to the point that maybe HE didn't get to relax at this rally.  There were prizes courtesy of PUT, a beautiful dinner, it was great!  I have great memories of this trip and to top it all off - we got our picture in PUT!  What an honor!!
 
Now....... fast forward almost one month and without warning we all read a post that there will be a fee, if you don't like it, oh well.  I am aware it was not in these exact words, but I DO remember feeling "slapped in the face" when I read it, and thinking it was written in a "matter of fact", "mechanical" tone.  What happened to the warm fuzzy feelings I got from the rally just weeks earlier??  Why wasn't anything said at the rally??  We had a few PUT meetings in that lodge room that would've been perfect times to say "We're probably going to need to charge a fee soon".  Why weren't we given some kind of warning??  All we got was WHAMMO!! here's what we're gonna do on this date - written in a cold manner...  Where were the warm fuzzies that we had come to love from PUT??  While reading that single post, I could feel "the magic" fading away....
 
Do I read any other pop up camping boards, honestly no.  I am now spending what would've been PUT internet time on eBay.  I need to get "the magic" feeling back, because eBay is getting quite expensive.  Seriously though, I hope this is NOT taken as "PUT bashing" because it's not.  PUT and Dave have made my life better - I couldn't imagine my life without PUT and this board.  I will continue to pay to write these posts and keep in touch with old friends and make new ones...  THANKS PUT!!
 
PS - I have looked for "PUT magic feeling" on eBay but it is never listed - anyone know where I can find any??  :p :D :confused:
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Post by: MommaMia on Feb 20, 2004, 06:53 AM
Quote from: copcarguyPS - I have looked for "PUT magic feeling" on eBay but it is never listed - anyone know where I can find any??  :p :D :confused:

Hall and Oates must know where you are coming from....


You never close your eyes anymore when I kiss your lips
And there's no tenderness like before in your finger tips
You're trying hard not to show it
But baby, baby I know it
You've Lost That Lovin' Feeling
Oh that Lovin' Feeling
You've Lost That Lovin' Feeling
Now it's gone gone gone oh oh oh
There's no welcome look in your eyes when I reach for you
And girl you're starting to criticize little things I do
Ooh, it makes me just feel like crying (baby)
'Cause baby something beautiful's dying
You've Lost That Lovin' Feeling
Oh that Lovin' Feeling
You've Lost That Lovin' Feeling
Not it's gone gone gone oh oh oh
Baby baby I get down on my knees for you
If you would only love me like you used to
(If you would only love me love me)
We had a love, a love that you don't find everyday
(A love you don't find)
So don't don't don't let it slip away (away)
I said baby
Baby
Baby
Baby
I need your love (I need your love)
I need your love
So bring it on back (bring it on back)
Now bring it on back
Now bring it on back
You've got to bring back that lovin' feeling
Oh that lovin' feeling
Bring back that lovin' feeling 'cause it's gone gone gone
oh oh oh
Bring back that lovin' feeling
Oh that lovin' feeling
Bring back that lovin' feeling 'cause it's gone gone gone
Bring back that lovin' feeling
Oh that lovin' feeling
Bring back that lovin' feeling 'cause it's gone gone gone
Bring back that lovin' feeling
Oh that lovin' feeling
Bring back that lovin' feeling 'cause it's gone gone gone
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Post by: gsm x2 on Feb 20, 2004, 09:41 AM
Quote from: MommaMiaHall and Oates must know where you are coming from....
 
 
You never close your eyes anymore when I kiss your lips
And there's no tenderness like before in your finger tips
You're trying hard not to show it
But baby, baby I know it
You've Lost That Lovin' Feeling
Oh that Lovin' Feeling
Hall and Oates?  I thought a sexy old lady and a tree-bashing congressman sang that song?  But then my DW corrected me.  Rightoues Brothers.
 
gsm x2
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Post by: MommaMia on Feb 20, 2004, 09:47 AM
Quote from: gsm x2Hall and Oates?  I thought a sexy old lady and a tree-bashing congressman sang that song?  But then my DW corrected me.  Rightoues Brothers.
 
gsm x2

Yes, Righteous Brothers.  But we have the Hall and Oates version in our cd repertoire.
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Post by: birol on Feb 20, 2004, 10:13 AM
Copcarguy, I have quite a few jars of PUT warm fuzzy feeling with me, I will list them on eBay if you wish, and at a specially  reduced price of lets say Five hundrend million Turkish Liras  :Oops:  :W  :J

Quote from: copcarguyHey all!!

........
PS - I have looked for "PUT magic feeling" on eBay but it is never listed - anyone know where I can find any??  :p :D :confused:
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Post by: MommaMia on Feb 20, 2004, 10:20 AM
Quote from: birolCopcarguy, I have quite a few jars of PUT warm fuzzy feeling with me, I will list them on eBay if you wish, and at a specially  reduced price of lets say Five hundrend million Turkish Liras  :Oops:  :W  :J


$317.16 US... Hmmmm... not a bad price for a whole lot of PUT love!
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Post by: birol on Feb 20, 2004, 10:23 AM
My admiration for you is incrasing every day; very fast/good calculation, BUT, it is closer to 384 USD  :J  :J

I also say, it is pretty cheap, and the jars come with a picture  of me on them  :Oops:

Quote from: MommaMia$317.16 US... Hmmmm... not a bad price for a whole lot of PUT love!
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Post by: MommaMia on Feb 20, 2004, 10:29 AM
Quote from: birolMy admiration for you is incrasing every day; very fast/good calculation, BUT, it is closer to 384 USD  :J  :J

I also say, it is pretty cheap, and the jars come with a picture  of me on them  :Oops:


Thanks for the kudos but I cheated.  The $317.16 is the "Mid Market Rate" for this hour from XE.com.  "Mid-market rates shown in our information services are neither "buy" rates nor "sell" rates. Mid-market rates are derived from mid-point between the buy and sell rates of large-value transactions in the global currency markets.

Since "buy rates" and "sell rates" include overheads and profit margins that are set independently by each foreign exchange provider, they will vary depending on who you're talking to, and will always be different than the mid-market rate.


Yahoo Finance says $374.18
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Post by: Trlrboy on Feb 20, 2004, 10:29 AM
You people need professional help.

Pack up the camper.
Hook up the TV.
Drive to the woods.
Set up the camper.

That's all there is to it.

The doctor is out.
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Post by: MommaMia on Feb 20, 2004, 10:32 AM
Quote from: TrlrboyYou people need professional help.

Pack up the camper.
Hook up the TV.
Drive to the woods.
Set up the camper.

That's all there is to it.

The doctor is out.


What is the going rate for professional help?
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Post by: copcarguy on Feb 20, 2004, 10:35 AM
I LOVE you guys!!  :D :D

birol - please check out my eBay feedback and you'll see I am a great eBayer!!  I'll use "buy it now"...  I hope you accept PayPal!
 
Trlrboy - We have a 3 day trip to a brand new KOA in PA the first weekend in March.  I need it.  The trailer is packed already.
 
Thanks to all for a smile this morning!
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Post by: B-flat on Feb 20, 2004, 10:37 AM
:eek:  :Oops: What, no disclaimer about not accepting medical advice? ;)  :D  I agree with the simple concept of camping, though. :cool:  :)
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Post by: birol on Feb 20, 2004, 11:11 AM
Well, I do need professional help ! But one one is offering me any so  I am the way I am !

The next OT post on this thread is going to  have a lightining bolt strike him/her ! I feel it coming, RUN FOR YOUR LIVEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSS  :J

Discliamer : This is why I love PUT, we now how to have a serious discussion and have fun at he same time. I look forward to being a part of this community this year as well :)
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Post by: angelsmom10 on Feb 20, 2004, 11:14 AM
birol, you know there's a market for just about anything out there...go ahead and create a "PUT...jar of love"....just remember to share your profit with us here on the board..:W
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Post by: griffsmom on Feb 20, 2004, 11:45 AM
Quote from: gsm x2Hall and Oates? I thought a sexy old lady and a tree-bashing congressman sang that song? But then my DW corrected me. Rightoues Brothers.
 
gsm x2
Hey scott,
 
I think you 're thinking of "I've got you, babe" :)
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Post by: Trlrboy on Feb 20, 2004, 12:33 PM
Quote from: griffsmomHey scott,
 
I think you 're thinking of "I've got you, babe" :)
That was Sonny and Cher.
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Post by: Trlrboy on Feb 20, 2004, 12:34 PM
Quote from: TrlrboyThat was Sonny and Cher.
Speaking of rock'n'roll (he said while hijacking the thread), what is the best girl singer song of modern times (last 45 years).  My vote is for "Bobby's Girl" by Marcie Blaine.
Title:
Post by: MommaMia on Feb 20, 2004, 07:29 PM
Quote from: TrlrboyThat was Sonny and Cher.


That's what Griffsmom was eluding to about Scott's comment on the sexy old lady and the tree bashing congressman! ;)
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Post by: NightOwl on Feb 20, 2004, 08:25 PM
WOW!  I go away for a day and come back to find that my thread has been SERIOUSLY  taken over  by SERIOUS music lovers.  Hee hee hee.

Just another example of why we all find this place so irresistable--never know what is going to happen next  or what Birol will be selling in his little jars of Magik Stuff.  Say,  zackly what color is a  Warm  Fuzzy and how much does it weigh?   Are they priced by weight or by the unit?  Is there an extra charge for the pic of Birol on the lable?  (No cheating, Birol--you cannot use your high school graduation picture and claim it was taken last week!!  :( )
Title:
Post by: NightOwl on Feb 21, 2004, 08:32 AM
WHOOPS--  :( had an e-mail from whitestar505 and it seems I  misunderstood the meaning of his post (#54) and took it to mean he didnt think we needed this discussion, and that the cost of things doesnt matter, so he got a rather stiff  and snotty reply from me. (post #55.)

 I  have copied the two posts in question below here so you can see how EASILY  we sometimes misunderstand each other when there was nothing arguementative  intended by a reply, but someone--me, in this case--took it that way.  All he meant was exactly what he said  (Was it Freud who said: "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar."?   :rolleyes:  :eek:  ;) )

(Also, my figure of $50.00 was WAY off because I somehow wasnt present or alert when Dave originally announced the  new  fee schedule  giving us the magazine and the  board membership combined--quite a bargain even at the old rate.)




------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted by whitestar505

"All,

All I have to say is give me the bill and let's get on with life. Life is to short and I rather be camping..."
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by NiightOwl:

"Not everyone has a lot of disposable income right now, so this information means more to some of us than it does to others. Believe it or not, there are actually people who cant afford "the bill" for both the magazine and the board right now (about $50.00 annually) so I imagine they will be very pleased with new rates.

And THEN we will all get on with life and go camping!  (Well, as soon as the weather is decent  )"

===========================================================



WHITESTAR505: I APOLOGIZE FOR  MISINTERPRETING WHAT YOU SAID AND AM VERY SORRY MY REPLY SOUNDED SO DISAPPROVING . I HOPE YOU WILL FORGIVE MY  REACTION TO YOUR INNOCENTLY INTENDED  REMARKS   :W
Title:
Post by: griffsmom on Feb 21, 2004, 09:21 AM
Quote from: NightOwl(Was it Freud who said: "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar."? :rolleyes: :eek: ;) )
if not Freud, then maybe Bill Clinton? ;) :D
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Post by: birol on Feb 21, 2004, 09:30 AM
Ok,

We are so not going to Cigars and Bill Clinton !  :D  :D  :D
Quote from: griffsmomif not Freud, then maybe Bill Clinton? ;) :D
Title:
Post by: NightOwl on Feb 21, 2004, 01:52 PM
Quote from: griffsmomif not Freud, then maybe Bill Clinton?


 :J  :eek:   if not Freud or Bill Clinton, then maybe Monica?  No, I guess she wouldnt  exactly say that  :D   :rolleyes:  :J

Birol, you HUSH now--you are too young and innocent  to know about things like that :Y
Title:
Post by: birol on Feb 21, 2004, 02:16 PM
I KNOW A SECRET , I KNOW A SECRET :

BLUE DRESS !!!!

Quote from: NightOwl:J  :eek:   if not Freud or Bill Clinton, then maybe Monica?  No, I guess she wouldnt  exactly say that  :D   :rolleyes:  :J

Birol, you HUSH now--you are too young and innocent  to know about things like that :Y
Title:
Post by: NightOwl on Feb 21, 2004, 05:32 PM
Quote from: birolI KNOW A SECRET , I KNOW A SECRET :

BLUE DRESS !!!!

Birol, you take that dress off RIGHT NOW!  Turkish men stopped wearing skirts many years ago except for some villages on feast days and you are in Canada now, not some distant village  :cool:  :eek:  :J
Title:
Post by: NightOwl on Feb 21, 2004, 05:34 PM
:eek: Oh my gosh, I've just helped hi-jack MY OWN THREAD! :eek:  :J
Title:
Post by: birol on Feb 21, 2004, 06:45 PM
Ok, I am so not going into wearing a dress. By the way, Turkish men never wore dress, it is just not macho, Kapish ? Turkish men are Macho creatures  :J


Quote from: NightOwlBirol, you take that dress off RIGHT NOW!  Turkish men stopped wearing skirts many years ago except for some villages on feast days and you are in Canada now, not some distant village  :cool:  :eek:  :J
Title:
Post by: wiininkwe on Feb 21, 2004, 07:56 PM
I was going to print a disclaimer.  I just haven't figured out yet just what it is I need to disclaim.   By the looks of this thread, when I think it over and get the right one, it will be a long one.
T
;)
Title:
Post by: tlhdoc on Feb 21, 2004, 09:38 PM
Quote from: birolOk, I am so not going into wearing a dress. By the way, Turkish men never wore dress, it is just not macho, Kapish ? Turkish men are Macho creatures  :J

Birol if you want to wear a blue dress, go ahead and wear one. :p   It is OK for you to be who you are.  Yes you can be macho in a dress, it is all in how you wear it. :J
Title:
Post by: NightOwl on Feb 21, 2004, 10:39 PM
Quote from: Birol: Ok, I am so not going into wearing a dress. By the way, Turkish men never wore dress, it is just not macho, Kapish ? Turkish men are Macho creatures  
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
* Today, 08:56 PM    
Post #98
wiininkwe
Member

Joined: Jan 2003
Location: Wyoming, Michigan
   
"I was going to print a disclaimer. I just haven't figured out yet just what it is I need to disclaim. By the looks of this thread, when I think it over and get the right one, it will be a long one."
T
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------   
              
* T
tlhdoc
Member

Joined: Dec 2002
Location: Central PA
   
Quote:
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted by birol
Ok, I am so not going into wearing a dress. By the way, Turkish men never wore dress, it is just not macho, Kapish ? Turkish men are Macho creatures  
------------------------------------------------------------------------

tlhdoc: "Birol if you want to wear a blue dress, go ahead and wear one.  It is OK for you to be who you are. Yes you can be macho in a dress, it is all in how you wear it."

============================================================



 OH, YOU GUYS ARE SUCH A TRIP!!  Heck, I'd pay a lot more than $30.00 if I had to just to hang out with you  Of all the reasons for staying here, we seldom mention the privilege of  socializing  with a bunch of crazy people     ;)  :J  :J  :XMas[/
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Post by: MommaMia on Feb 21, 2004, 11:27 PM
Quote from: NightOwlsocializing  with a bunch of crazy people     ;)  :J  :J  :XMas[/



Who you calling crazy???

[elisa voice on] "Hello, kettle, this is Nightowl....."[/elisa voice] :J
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Post by: B-flat on Feb 21, 2004, 11:40 PM
Disclaimer:  The opinions expressed in this thread belong to those who are addicted to PUT in such a bad way that there is no cure.  All are hopelessly trapped here under their own accord to the point that camping has become an exact science and the campfire just makes for a "real place" that these folks needing "professional camping help" can go any time.
Title:
Post by: birol on Feb 22, 2004, 09:57 AM
The weather is nice, it is around 34 F I believe. I might get the camping gear out, and clean them and get them ready for the summer !

We still don't know where we will go, and if we will go, but, camping gear need to be respected !

I am not a crazy person ! I might be little bit different, but that is about it.
Title:
Post by: NightOwl on Feb 22, 2004, 02:24 PM
Quote from: birolI am not a crazy person ! I might be little bit different, but that is about it.

Birol--if you are crazy and rich, you are called "eccentric."  if you are  almost everyone else and you are crazy, you are called "crazy."  if you are from Turkey, you are called "little bit different"  ;)  What it all adds up to as far as I  am concerned is a bunch of interestingly  oddball people who like to hang out on this board.

Some might call us crazy. some have referred to us as a "cult."   Whatever it is we are, a lot of people are envious of the fun we manage to have   :W    


 disclaimer:  the word "crazy" as used in this context is not meant to imply serious mental illnes (mild, maybe, but not serious.)  The claims made here refect only the opinions of elisa a. frye and are not intended as psychiatric diagnoses--unless, of course, they actually apply to YOU  in which case, dont worry as  you are not required to divulge the true state of your mental health   :J
Title:
Post by: whitestar505 on Feb 23, 2004, 10:14 AM
NightOwl,
 
   Thanks,
 
Quote from: NightOwlWHOOPS-- :( had an e-mail from whitestar505 and it seems I misunderstood the meaning of his post (#54) and took it to mean he didnt think we needed this discussion, and that the cost of things doesnt matter, so he got a rather stiff and snotty reply from me. (post #55.)
 
I have copied the two posts in question below here so you can see how EASILY we sometimes misunderstand each other when there was nothing arguementative intended by a reply, but someone--me, in this case--took it that way. All he meant was exactly what he said (Was it Freud who said: "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar."? :rolleyes: :eek: ;) )
 
(Also, my figure of $50.00 was WAY off because I somehow wasnt present or alert when Dave originally announced the new fee schedule giving us the magazine and the board membership combined--quite a bargain even at the old rate.)
 
 
 
 
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted by whitestar505
 
"All,
 
All I have to say is give me the bill and let's get on with life. Life is to short and I rather be camping..."
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by NiightOwl:
 
"Not everyone has a lot of disposable income right now, so this information means more to some of us than it does to others. Believe it or not, there are actually people who cant afford "the bill" for both the magazine and the board right now (about $50.00 annually) so I imagine they will be very pleased with new rates.
 
And THEN we will all get on with life and go camping! (Well, as soon as the weather is decent )"
 
===========================================================
 
 
 
WHITESTAR505: I APOLOGIZE FOR MISINTERPRETING WHAT YOU SAID AND AM VERY SORRY MY REPLY SOUNDED SO DISAPPROVING . I HOPE YOU WILL FORGIVE MY REACTION TO YOUR INNOCENTLY INTENDED REMARKS :W
Title:
Post by: B-flat on Feb 23, 2004, 05:01 PM
Computers don't have emotions and that's why we use those cute little smilies.  I would still like to have that one back which looks like a red devil with horns.  I miss that icon most.
Title:
Post by: moderator1 on Feb 23, 2004, 05:05 PM
Quote from: B-flatComputers don't have emotions and that's why we use those cute little smilies.  I would still like to have that one back which looks like a red devil with horns.  I miss that icon most.


Found it   :Z
Title:
Post by: B-flat on Feb 23, 2004, 05:33 PM
That one will do.  Thanks.  Do you remember the one where the little horns are also red and just move up and out of the head?  That was the one I was thinking of.  Seems like it was also the one we had on the old board. :Z
Title:
Post by: Miller Tyme on Feb 25, 2004, 02:05 AM
Back to the original thread for a sec....:#

Dying? No. Slow? Yes.
Am I staying? Yes.
Why? Because this is the board that got me into Pop-up Camping. While I may have gone to other boards(and even moderate one), I, too, feel a sense of "family" here. Everything from trying to find Birol a camper, to AB's tales of camping woes, to all the general good advice from everyone. I feel very comfortable here.:!
The way I look at it, the more info and tales of camping, the better. And, the addition of the magazine is the capper.:D
Keep up the good work, everyone! (And, Birol, take off the blue dress.):eek: :Z
Title:
Post by: angelsmom10 on Feb 25, 2004, 07:30 AM
Thanks for allowing me to stay.... the board is great and I read every page of the magazine when I get it.  Thanks!
Title:
Post by: birol on Feb 25, 2004, 09:53 AM
I would like to get the magazine too, may I  ? I never received it ....
Title:
Post by: B-flat on Feb 25, 2004, 10:12 AM
Hmmmm, Birol, I though I mailed all of mine to you last year! :Z
Title:
Post by: birol on Feb 25, 2004, 10:31 AM
Yup, and I still have them, devouring them now and then. I meant for this year :)

Quote from: B-flatHmmmm, Birol, I though I mailed all of mine to you last year! :Z
Title:
Post by: angelsmom10 on Feb 25, 2004, 10:57 AM
There's only been one this year so far...
Title:
Post by: Mountaineer on Feb 28, 2004, 08:59 AM
It's beginning ta sound like ol' times.  The last time I was here was the last time I was on my computer, 1-17-04.  I don't get to use it much, ...... so much to do.....   I was one one of those who spent much time lurking on the site; almost a year before I joined up.  I am not one to accumulate posts.   We have been popup campers for 25  years and were thrilled when we discovered the site and the magazine.  We had a great time at the Little River Rally.  We would have enjoyed the rally last year but schedules didn't match.  This year is the same,   but   we will be looking forward to hearing about the great times y'all  will tell us about later this summer.   The family will join up with another campout/rally when the planets are lined up.  
     Wiininkwe said it all in her post.  Dave is a good guy. He has created a good product that I enjoy.  I will continue with my membership and the magazine.

     Thanks, Dave.
      Phil