PopUp Times

Greetings All!

I have never actually camped in the National Forest Campgrounds, staying mostly in the State Parks or private facilities, and have a question for the collective group!

You hear all the time about how unsafe the National Forest/Park Campgrounds are from people that have never camped in them, and I wanted the TRUTH...and I can handle the truth, lol.

I know that everywhere you go, you must protect yourself by being smart, about camping spots, your gear, and your self.

Each year more and more reports about crime and violence against campers are reported on (in the newspaper and on TV)...

How do you guys feel about camping in areas such as these? Do you take any special precautions when camping in these types of campgrounds!

It really upsets me to think that we have to give up the most beautiful spots and some truelly breathtaking vistas because some are totally disrespectful of others!

As I get ready to start camping an extensive amount in the near future, should I rule out the NF/NP CG's?

Thanks!

First of all, I think you should make a big distinction between National FOREST and National PARK campgrounds. They are operated by two totally different federal agencies. The PARKs are run by the National Park Service, and they tend to get much more traffic than the FORESTS which are run by the USDA Forest Service. I have had much more experience camping in the National Parks than in the National Forests, so I'll speak about the parks. I have found the National Parks to be extremely safe. I have camped only in established campgrounds, sometimes known as "frontcountry" campgrounds. There have always been rangers and/or campground hosts very closeby, and they have been very responsive to any disturbances in the campgrounds. In fact, campgrounds in the National Parks are my favorite places to camp.

We camp in both State and National Forests, both in and out of MI.  In all the years we haven't ever felt threatened or feared for our safety.  Many of the places we've camped are kind of out of the way tiny barely developed campgrounds. Probably to far to the beer store for most trouble makers to go to.

The majority of our camping is done at very remote forest service campgrounds here in Colorado.  We have never had a problem.  Of course the more negative reports that go around, the better!  It means less people and more vacancies!

This is from our campsite at a small remote NFS campground:
(http://cul8r.smugmug.com/photos/64639586-M.jpg)
And this looking from the mountain back down at the lake and campground:
(http://cul8r.smugmug.com/photos/48769887-M.jpg)
Jim

Quote from: CUL8RThe majority of our camping is done at very remote forest service campgrounds here in Colorado.  We have never had a problem.  Of course the more negative reports that go around, the better!  It means less people and more vacancies!

This is from our campsite at a small remote NFS campground:

And this looking from the mountain back down at the lake and campground:

Jim

I know exactly where these pictures are from...I love that area!

We spent a week just outside of CB when I was just out of HSchool camping, then my family and I went back and stayed for a week at Almont just a couple of years ago. We were all over that area, lol!

I also enjoyed our time around the Leadville area and Turquoise Lake, however, I think that one of the prettiest spots on the planet was Estes Park and the RMNP.

Thanks for sharing the photos and the memories, lol!

Interesting.  I have never felt threatened or unsafe in a state/national park/national forest campground.

On the other hand - I have felt unsafe in a private campground even after complaining to management about the situation.  We left that place.

I have never suffered a loss (knock on wood) camping but also realize that anyone can get into our tenting and so just don't leave anything there we can't afford to lose.

If media driven hysteria is your thing, though, Stay away.  As was said, 'More room for the rest of us!'

Quote from: abbearInteresting.  I have never felt threatened or unsafe in a state/national park/national forest campground.

On the other hand - I have felt unsafe in a private campground even after complaining to management about the situation.  We left that place.

I have never suffered a loss (knock on wood) camping but also realize that anyone can get into our tenting and so just don't leave anything there we can't afford to lose.

If media driven hysteria is your thing, though, Stay away.  As was said, 'More room for the rest of us!'

Well,I hope that your response wasn't pointed at me, lol!

It doesn't have to be "media driven hysteria" as you put it, I just know what I see on the news or in the papers!

Just because you want to be away from the crowd, doesn't mean that you are safe, only vulnerable.

I only wrote to garner opinions (How do you guys feel about camping in areas such as these? Do you take any special precautions when camping in these types of campgrounds!)

I take my family with me so I do try and make sure I protect them to the best of my ability...and sometimes that is by using my brains!

Thanks for you imput...

Quote from: BrantimeEach year more and more reports about crime and violence against campers are reported on (in the newspaper and on TV)...

A bit of thinking about this are in order.

I used to live in Boston, where they would pick up on a national story about some crime in a National Park or Forest.  The same crime might be committed 40 times a day in Boston, but not be reported.

Why?  Because crime in a National Park or Forest is uncommon.  Crime in Boston (or any other major metro area) is not uncommon.  Would you watch a news broadcast that listed off the 120 shoplifitings, 15 muggings, 25 A&B's, 19 break-ins, four home invasions, one rape and one murder that happened yestersay?  Of course not.  So they might mention the murder, and then spend ten minutes on the "rising danger" of crime in Monkey-Wrench National Forest, where two teen boys were robbed of their backpacks.  They would find an "expert" to interview, send a field crew out, and even report on how "terrified" the boys were.  You could count on it coming up at least three times in the coming weeks, as well.  

The media are seldom reliable places for perspective.  Profits urge them to blow things out of proportion.

Austin

If you're refering to the nut case down here in florida @ ocala NF, well that could have happened anywhere. My son and I have been camping (tent) in the the forests of New mexico and colorado for 20 years and I believe we only used a "campground" a few times when the kids were young. (Granted it was a primitive campground ouside of Alamogordo and very secluded.)  And now here in Florida, where I've been using the state parks/forest. But mostly I would just head out one of the forest roads and find a nice spot. I've never had a problem, well at least human, when I've done so. The designated campgrounds are more of a problem, peoples tv's or music. kids running around out of control, it's like being in wal-mart!

gypsy_soul]If you're refering to the nut case down here in florida @ ocala NF, well that could have happened anywhere.

Hey gypsy!

Thanks for your imput on the subject!

I was not asking due to any particular or specific location! I just wanted to know if any of the POPUP group here took any extra precautions when  camping in the National Forest...

We have spent many weeks camping in the unimproved areas over the years and love the solitude! I haven't camped like this since I have had a family to take with me. We have staying mainly in the State Parks.

Thanks again!

While camping at a National Forest campground in the High Sierras, called Jackass Campground,  (no kidding), which by no coincidence whatsoever adjoins Jackass Meadow, we did take special precautions!

First, and most important, we brought flip-flops.  You see they have free hot showers that are fed by natural hot springs, but the bathhouses are kinda green and slimy with algae. Gotta protect those feet!!

Second, I purchased some D-Cell batteries for my Maglite after our first night there.  We had heard some scratching and bark falling from high up in a tree, but we couldn't see anything!!  Terror!  The next night we saw the racoons doing their thing!

See, there are some special precautions that must be taken sometimes!!

I prefer Nation Park campgrounds and our State Park campgrounds.  I have always felt safe with the Rangers on duty in the park.  At the busy parks and during peak seasons some of the Rangers are full peace officers and take care of business.

We haven't camped in the National Forest campgrounds because they tend to be out of the way and offer fewer facilities (with 3 little ones, we need facilites), and I don't believe there are too many Rangers close by.
 
Overall I feel pretty safe at most all campgrounds.

We mostly camp in USFS campgrounds in the forests of Montana.  The one time we had a bad experience was when a teenage beer party got out of hand..  In fact that one time was the only time we've SEEN a teenage beer party out in a NF campground....   Anyway, we didn't feel unsafe because law enforcement showed up and stayed there all night waiting for stragglers to stumble out of the trees and back into the camp to get their cars which the cops were sort of "babysitting".  ha ha.   Those were some really obnoxious kids!!  All kinds of obsenities being yelled at the cops, to the point where I was really glad I didn't have any little ones with me to hear it all.  :(     That was the last time I will ever stay at a NF campground that is near a town on a national holiday!!  been there, done that, learned something.

I just joined so I could ask.. is this LOST LAKE? I have camped there several times and this certainly looks familiar.  

I live in Muggy Missouri but am a Colorado Camper at heart  :)  I have camped all over the western United States at NFS campgrounds, NP campgrounds, State parks, etc. Never felt threatened in any way, and I am a female with kids that often travels without my husband.

Quote from: CUL8RThe majority of our camping is done at very remote forest service campgrounds here in Colorado.  We have never had a problem.  Of course the more negative reports that go around, the better!  It means less people and more vacancies!

coulter,

Good memory!  that is indeed lost lake (actually the NFS campground is on Lost Lake Slough).  Lost lake and Dollar lake are a short hike away.  Very beautiful and peaceful.

Jim

I thought so, I have pictures that look amazingly similar to those :) It is a gorgeous place, and so quiet.

Leesa

Quote from: CUL8Rcoulter,

Good memory!  that is indeed lost lake (actually the NFS campground is on Lost Lake Slough).  Lost lake and Dollar lake are a short hike away.  Very beautiful and peaceful.

Jim

I was very surprised to see your concerns about camping in a National Forest.  I camp about 15 times a year and most of the time it is in a National Forest.  I have never had any problems with theft or anything like that.  The sites are usually larger and spaced further apart than a private campground or state park.  I have been popup camping for five years and have never used my hookups, as I prefer dry camping.

Quote from: BrantimeYou hear all the time about how unsafe the National Forest/Park Campgrounds are from people that have never camped in them, and I wanted the TRUTH...and I can handle the truth, lol.

The truth is - this is nonsense.  I have never heard that the NF or NP campgrounds are unsafe.  

I wonder where you got this information?

Quote from: tjy355The truth is - this is nonsense.  I have never heard that the NF or NP campgrounds are unsafe.  

I wonder where you got this information?

The information is readily available if you choose to watch the news or read the newspapers! Also during our last trip, the Ranger on Duty told us they had been having some problems with items being appropriated!

An incident happened while I was camping in the mountains with a group some time ago...at the same time, a group of women were camping/hiking and several of them were killed...

The sole purpose of this post was to see how many campers took extra precautions while camping, i.e....Do you lock all your chairs in the trailer while you are away from the site? Do you happen to lock your tounge (on the trailer) when you leave the site? Etc...  

This post had nothing to do with my PERSONAL SAFETY...it had to do with the safety of my Stuff, lol!

Don't be so quick to criticize...I was just after some opinions from some helpful campers...and to those that offered constructive opinions, thanks!

To all those others...Wow!

QuoteOriginally Posted by tjy355
 The truth is - this is nonsense.  I have never heard that the NF or NP campgrounds are unsafe.  
 
 I wonder where you got this information?

There are isolated incidents that happen. While we personaly have not had any issues arise, my BIL & SIL did have trouble in a NF campground once. Since then they do carry protection when camping back in the woods. If and when we ever did feel the need to carry some sort of protection we would too.

Our current mode of protection has 4 legs, lots of teeth and  a slight protective streak.

Quote from: ForestCreature
There are isolated incidents that happen. While we personaly have not had any issues arise, my BIL & SIL did have trouble in a NF campground once. Since then they do carry protection when camping back in the woods. If and when we ever did feel the need to carry some sort of protection we would too.

Our current mode of protection has 4 legs, lots of teeth and  a slight protective streak.

Thanks FC...

My current mode of protection is also very protective, weighs about 5 pounds, sleeps under the cover with us, lol, however, she does hear all; she just thinks she is a lot larger than she is :)

Quote from: BrantimeMy current mode of protection is also very protective, weighs about 5 pounds,

LOL, ours is a whopping 40 lbs. and sounds like an 80 lb dog. But I have  absolutely no doubt that he would protect us or our posessions.

He's more protective than our old 85 lb bouv mix was, she was a gentle giant just looked scary.  

I guess I misunderstood some of what you asked.  We aren't worried about camping in NFS campgrounds (or most other places).  We don't take special precautions, but we are always careful no matter where we camp.  We always lock our vehicles (and anything valuable is in the vehicle), and we always have a hitch lock on the PU.  Our generator is always locked to the PU or in the vehicle.  These precautions are easily gotten around, but that takes time and makes noise.  I think they are just common sense.  We also have 2 classes of personal protection with us on all our trips.  One type we always carry with us(Colorado is a CCW state), and one type who accompanies us on all our trips.  They are pretty well trained, don't bark, and friendly.  But I think +900 lbs of dogs tends to keep problems at bay in the campground and on the trails.
(http://cul8r.smugmug.com/photos/58380415-M.jpg)
(http://cul8r.smugmug.com/photos/48769877-M.jpg)
(http://cul8r.smugmug.com/photos/48769880-M.jpg)
(http://cul8r.smugmug.com/photos/55520074-M.jpg)
Jim

CUL8R,
What a fantastic bunch of kids you have! That baby on the bottom can come home with me anytime!

I don't mean to be offensive, but I find it silly to be alarmed or even concerned about media reports of isolated and unrelated incidents WHEREVER.

Yes, I read the papers and watch the news. Have I seen anything that makes me fear my safety in the national forests? No.

For example, there was a well publicized mass murder incident at McDonalds. Does anyone take extra precautions when visiting McDonalds??

Now, if there were reports of a series of crimes taking place in a certain location and the perpetrator(s) were still at large, then yes, I would be concerned and avoid that particular area, whether that be a forest campground or a parking lot at a WalMart.  But to take a few reports and translate that into "NF/NP campgrounds are unsafe" is really... what's the right word... alarmist.

To answer your question, do I take any extra precautions when camping in a National Forest or Park - no.

I fell less of a need to protect my valuables and myself when camping in the NF than I do in town.  Yes, I lock the doors of the PU when leaving it for the day, of course, that wouldn't stop someone from cutting the roof to get in.  I leave my chairs, table, stove, grill, and cooking utensils out the entire time, I guess I figure that if someone needs to steal that, they really need it more than I do.  Gives me an excuse to go buy new gear.  I do lock my car at night, but that is more about bears than humans.
I have been camping in the National Forests in Colorado for over 30 years and have never felt like my personal possessions nor my personal safety is being threatened.  I find nicer, friendlier, more neighborly folks in the mountains and National Forests than I do in Denver, and Denver is a pretty friendly place.
I do agree, the media is always looking for the unique stories and more crime happens within 5 miles of my home than it does within 5 miles of my campsite.  I guess it all depends on what you choose to pay attention to.

Boy, I have not even worried about safety in forests and I boondock in the northern Rockies.  I worry more about RV parks.  I camp with dogs so carry "protection" in case someting attacks them, but have never used it.

We do a lot of hunting and general camping in Sabine National Forest.  Its' NOT a National Campground.  Never have had a problem.  We leave the trailer  (unlocked) and all cars there but one when we go somewhere.  At night we hear if someone comes into camp.  So we'll watch out th window to see who it is, and move on.  We have never had a problem.  The nearest blacktop road is 8 miles, the closest store with phone service is 13 miles.  Our cell do not work most of the time.  Now I will say this I will not go by myself.  But that's just a general rule for any outdoor/wilderness adventure.  Here are some pics.

(http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h288/gager2002/MVC-014S.jpg)
(http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h288/gager2002/Camp-SNF2002-2.jpg)
(http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h288/gager2002/Camp-SNF2002-1.jpg)
(http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h288/gager2002/Camp-SNF2002-3.jpg)

San Isabel National Forest, Colorado, 10-15 miles from blacktop, Memorial Day

(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j317/danthone/Memorial%20Day%2006/P5270024.jpg)

(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j317/danthone/Memorial%20Day%2006/P5270014.jpg)

(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j317/danthone/Memorial%20Day%2006/P5270012.jpg)

Of course, you have to put up with the locals around these parts:

(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j317/danthone/Memorial%20Day%2006/P5270020.jpg)

If and when I have safety concerns I always take along a couple of old buddies with me. My favorites are Mr Smith & Mr Wesson    :D

Here is a pic of our last boondocking trip.  I love Colorado!!!

(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j317/danthone/Fourth%20of%20July%20weekend%2006/P7010003.jpg)

(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j317/danthone/Fourth%20of%20July%20weekend%2006/P7030005.jpg)

(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j317/danthone/Fourth%20of%20July%20weekend%2006/P7030011.jpg)

Well, wierd stuff does happen (follow the link below).  If this happened to me when I was camped with the family, I don't think I would have chanced one of the dogs getting hurt by putting one of them after this guy.  If I really considered him a viable threat to the kids or wife, he'd get exactly one warning of what was going to happen to him.  Then if he persisted in his attack, I would have immediately acted to protect my family. In that event I don't think the Sheriff would have needed the ambulance.  I think he actually was pretty lucky.  Sounds like a prospective Darwin award winner.

Campground Fight+ (http://www.denverpost.com/ci_3861397?source=rss)

Jim

Sounds like on of those - I would never punish my child for doing anything wrong, he is just acting out," or "I may bruise his little emotions", or "my son does no wrong".  You know what I mean.  

No question, they took it easy on him.  Miles from the police, family so vounerable out in the woods, no games with the live of the poeple God has entrusted me to protect.  Sorry.

The one thing ive noticed about most of these stories is that the victims
did not have a firearm? Ive always wondered who goes out into the deep woods without a firearm. Maybe Im just a real country bumpkin,but id dare any nut case to come messing with my camp while im in it!!!
Just an idea to ponder??

Quote from: CUL8RThe majority of our camping is done at very remote forest service campgrounds here in Colorado.  We have never had a problem.  Of course the more negative reports that go around, the better!  It means less people and more vacancies!

This is from our campsite at a small remote NFS campground:

And this looking from the mountain back down at the lake and campground:

Jim

Jim - I am planning a trip with my family to the Colorado Springs area this summer - where did you take these pictures? I have got to get my family to that location! we are planning on spending two days there before heading to the Durango area for a night or two - can you suggest any place around there as well?

thanks -

Quote from: dfonnerJim - I am planning a trip with my family to the Colorado Springs area this summer - where did you take these pictures? I have got to get my family to that location! we are planning on spending two days there before heading to the Durango area for a night or two - can you suggest any place around there as well?

thanks -

Be patient for an answer...CUL8R (aka Jim) doesn't come here often.  His last visit was in February.

You might try emailing him directly (use the Profile link on the bottom of his post).

Austin

I'm positive that the pictures are from Lost Lake campground, which is near Crested Butte.  We camped there last summer.  It's gorgeous--I'll be back again sometime.  The road is a bit rough to get there, and there aren't very many sites, so I'd suggest coming on a weekday rather than weekend.  But well worth it.

It's in the Gunnison National Forest.  You access by the Kebler Pass road.  Here's a link to someone's review of it, with many more gorgeous photos:  http://www.aroundcolorado.com/trip_reports/2004_0601_LostLake/index.html

Quote from: AustinBostonBe patient for an answer...CUL8R (aka Jim) doesn't come here often.  His last visit was in February.

You might try emailing him directly (use the Profile link on the bottom of his post).

Austin

Thanks Austin

Quote from: dfonnerThanks Austin

Did you catch my post above?  If you can't get a hold of cul8ter, I am absolutely 100% positive that the picture in question is of Lost Lake.  That's much closer to Durango than Colorado Springs.  It's about three hours north of Durango, and about an hour south of Glenwood Springs.  Probably not near where you are going, but worth going out of your way for, IMHO.

If you need more info about Lost Lake, PM me.

Quote from: mountainrevDid you catch my post above?  If you can't get a hold of cul8ter, I am absolutely 100% positive that the picture in question is of Lost Lake.  That's much closer to Durango than Colorado Springs.  It's about three hours north of Durango, and about an hour south of Glenwood Springs.  Probably not near where you are going, but worth going out of your way for, IMHO.

If you need more info about Lost Lake, PM me.

Thanks mountainrev - our trip itinerary is not set in stone yet. My plan is to go through Colorado, hit the four corners and then make it over to the Grand Canyon and then...? Beyond that, I am completely open to suggestions. Any advise is greatly appreciated.

thank you -