So I am shopping for some extended mirrors so I can see what
McKesh Mirrors (http://www.hensleymfg.com) are a popular item. I like mine, but I didn't get them until I got the hybrid. You can literally see very close behind the trailer with them.
Larry
We use these strap-on mirrors:
http://www.campingworld.com/browse/skus/index.cfm?skunum=10438&src=SRQB
Some people don't like them because they aren't real stable. It doesn't bother me. However, I seldom drive over 60MPH while towing. Over 60, the wind really blows these mirrors around.
It also depends on the shape of your factory mirrors. When I used them On my Concorde, they were slightly more problematic because the straps would slide down the tapered mirror. On our S10 pick-up, they work perfectly.
The person that I bought this truck from used the McKesh Mirrors (like in the above post). They damaged the paint a little. You can see exactly where the support rested on the doors. he offered to give me the mirrors with the truck and I declined. He wasn't real happy with what they did to the doors.
Yes I have looked at the McKesh mirrors and though they boast that they will not damage your vehicle I can
Quote from: harleywolfYes I have looked at the McKesh mirrors and though they boast that they will not damage your vehicle I can
ironically i have just posted on the jeep commander forum asking about extended mirrors...thanks guys
What about the Cipa's? Not sure if they make 'em for the Jeep, but the ones I've seen for GM/Ford applications look very stock.....covering the whole mirror like a sleeve and adding a 3-4" square additional mirror at the very end.
Of course, if you weren't playing around with those little Jeep things, you wouldn't have this problem.......but I digress, and dive for cover.
i,ll look into the cipa,s.....but a 7 passenger jeep commander is not exactly "a little jeep thing"
I don't use extended mirrors, but with our setup (tall tow vehicle, no A/C on trailer), we can see OVER the trailer.
I'm going to go a little off-topic and I am not trying to hijack the tread, but if you are not towing, or if you can use your rear-view mirror, you should NOT be able to see your own vehicle or your trailer in your side mirrors. Let me explain.
Like most people, for years I adjusted my side mirrors so I could just barely see my car in the mirror. Then, when I was on the highway, I was always careful to turn my head and check my "blind spot" before changing lanes. Then I read an article in a AAA publication that described what I did, and said it was very common, but completely wrong
and dangerous.
There are three main problems with that method:
- There is still a blind spot. Unless you turn your head so far that your forehead touches the side window, there is an area you are not seeing by turning your head.
- When travelling forward, your head should not be pointing backward, it should be pointing forward. If something happens during that "glance over the shoulder" you loose significant reaction time, up to 1/2 second (about 45 feet or several car lengths at 60 MPH).
- There is a natural tendency, when you turn your head, to also turn the steering wheel. Most of us have learned to compensate, but we had to learn to do so; it is not natural. In addition, if you are trying to change lanes on a curve, even a gradual one, you probably still have issues with managing the steering.
What AAA said to do is to lean halfway to the window on the driver's side, then adjust to barely see your vehicle. Lean the same amount to the passenger side. They said it might take a few tries to figure out exactly how much to lean. When properly adjusted, the driver's side mirror will seem to be pointed off into some unexplainable space, and the passenger side will be more-or-less centered on the lane to your right.
Then just watch what you can see in the mirrors.
I was very surprised. There is NO blind spot. A car passing (on either side) is always clearly visible. I see a headlight appear in the side mirror the moment it disappears from the rearview. As the car passes me, even a small car stays in the mirror until the front of the car is right beside me. There simply is no blind spot, and I no longer need to take my eyes off of the road ahead to do the swivel-headed check before changing lanes.
One of the other benefits is that nighttime headlight glare from the side mirrors is reduced. The mirror doesn't reflect a passing vehicle's headlights at you until they are at a point where the headlights are normally pointed past you, not at you. This doesn't work for badly aimed headlights, but it does help with most vehicles on the road today.
Obviously, it does not work if you can not see over your trailer; in that case, you still need at least one mirror that can see behind the trailer.
Austin
Huh, very interesting AustinB, I
Quote from: LimeJeeeepi,ll look into the cipa,s.....but a 7 passenger jeep commander is not exactly "a little jeep thing"
Just giving you a hard time with my 9 passenger 'burb.
Quote from: austinado16What about the Cipa's? Not sure if they make 'em for the Jeep, but the ones I've seen for GM/Ford applications look very stock.....covering the whole mirror like a sleeve and adding a 3-4" square additional mirror at the very end.
Of course, if you weren't playing around with those little Jeep things, you wouldn't have this problem.......but I digress, and dive for cover.
Geez Todd.........why would you need extension mirrors at all :confused: .....that tank is wider than your PU... :yikes:
Quote from: waveryGeez Todd.........why would you need extension mirrors at all :confused: .....that tank is wider than your PU... :yikes:
The Sub-Urbans come set up for towing, as did the Blazer, so those are the factory power mirrors. There are Cipas made for them, and look just like the factory mirror but extend a further 4 or 5". So no, it's not sporting add-on towing mirrors.
It's exactly as wide as the PUP, so the PUP is basically along for a free ride.
Quote from: harleywolfSo I am shopping for some extended mirrors so I can see what
I have the McKesh mirrors, and as soon as I got them I got concerned about the potential they have to mar the paint on the doors. So, I am meticulous about cleaning both the door and the pad (on the mirror support) every time I strap them on. If you have even tiny grains of "dirt" between the door and the pad you'll end up with scratches. I figure that if there is absolutely no dirt between the door and the pad the liklihood of scratching is much less.
-Speak
I had the Cipa universal mirrors. They weren't great but stable. You had to keep adjusting them because they walk down the mirrors. They worked OK on my Nissan Titan.
With the Nissan Pathfinder, they don't work. The original Cipa universal mirrors has a clip system, you could change to the large of small clips. Neither opened wide enough to allow the Pathfinder's mirror lip to fit. So $70 in the drain.
Now I went to the strap on mirrors mentioned but mine are for SUV mirrors and not the metal thin truck mirrors.
These absolutely suck big time, but they don't harm the paint finish of the mirrors. The straps have to be tight so that the wind doesn't move the mirrors. However the straps are cracking already on the "2nd" pair. The first pair had one of the plastic hooks crack. So these have to be replaced every year or 2. Really bad quality.
The McKesh do harm your paint as I've read several complaints about the damage they do. Also if your vehicle gets the mirror clipped, they don't give and you'll have a very nice dent or completely damaged door to repair.
I think the fender mirrors are the best, but they do have to be tightened on the paint finish of the fender. However they usually have a rubber boot that doesn't do as much harm. My dad used these for years for our camper and horse trailer towing with the '76 Chevy Stationwagon. He's a car buff and has 5 show cars so I know for a fact if the fender mirrors did damage, he'd not use them.
Cipa has a new improved universal mirror that uses a hook instead of a clip. I'm going to try to get those hooks for my universal mirrors since I have them still. If not, I'll probably buy a new pair of universal mirrors. I like the fact that they can't harm your paint and if they get clipped, at most you'll have your cars mirror damaged and not body fenders or door panels.:)
They also have a mirror that is a suction cup and sticks to your vehicle's mirror. This seems great but then I realized I use the vehicles mirror for passing and such, and use the trailer mirrors to see if I have vehicles behind me. I use both and this suction mirror would obviously block view of the vehicles mirror.
Have a good one.
Maybe the bottom line is.......do you really need trailering mirrors to tow a PUP? Maybe I'm just spoiled because I'm driving something that's built for towing?
Mike, thanks for the informative reply.
At a rally this weekend I looked at the McKesh mirrors on of our members TV. He loves them and they seem to install fairly simple. I didn
The Strap on mirrors that I didn't like are also made by Cipa but they are not good for wide trailers. I can barely see down the sides of my PUP because the straps can not be installed on the edge of the mirror because the mirror back is a sloping bubble shape. At the edge, the straps just pull off. I can see down the sides good enough to see something behind me and to the sides but with anything wider than a 7'2" PUP, they wouldn't work with my trucks mirrors.
As for not needing mirrors at all, it all depends on your vehicle and camper. When I had the Rockwood and the Nissan Titan, I could see if someone was behind me, except if they were tailgating. The Rockwood's AC was to the side and the truck sat tall so I could see over the camper. The mirrors helped to see those idiots who were tailgating the camper that I couldn't see with the truck mirrors.
With the Pathfinder and the Starcraft, it's a different story. I can't see anything because the camper has it's AC centered in the roof and the SUV doesn't sit as tall as the Titan. I can't see over the camper good enough. I can see over it but to see cars behind it, they have to be a good distance behind the camper. I can't see closer cars. With the Pathfinder, I need tow mirrors.
I'll likely go to the new Cipa Universal Mirrors with the hooks if I can't get the hook accessories for my older Universal mirrors. For me, it comes down to Cipa Universal Mirrors, Cipa Fender Mirrors, or Tow-n-See mirrors (//%22http://www.tow-n-see.com/%22) (judging by the pictures, they don't seem to block as much of the view as I thought so they may work).
I won't be buying anymore Cipa Strap on mirrors because the clips broke on the first set I had only for a year, and the second set in it's first year has the rubber straps cracking badly and will soon rip. These mirrors are nothing but JUNK. But when you don't have anything that will fit or 'not' damage your paint, you'll use.
Good luck and have a good one.
hey guys ,just a follow up ..i purchased some inexepensive mirrors at camping world item #25855...they shake ,but not much...
http://www.campingworld.com/browse/skus/index.cfm/Outdoor-and-RV-Accessories/25855/skunum=25855:src=SRQB
they will surfice for now...BTW we are a hybrid owners now 04 travelstar 19ck
After reading some reviews on the Tow-n-See mirror, I may just buy these. Every review is very positive on them. The convex mirrors seem to be the ones to buy. Camping World has some good reviews on the flat (//%22http://www.campingworld.com/browse/skus/index.cfm/Outdoor-and-RV-Accessories/TowNSee-Mirror-Flat/skunum=33271#reviews%22) and convex (//%22http://www.campingworld.com/browse/skus/index.cfm/Outdoor-and-RV-Accessories/TowNSee-Mirror/Convex/skunum=33272#reviews%22)mirrors. There are some other reviews also as here's one (//%22http://www.mrtrailer.com/infinityqx56.htm%22). Here's some other good reviews (//%22http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/20192423.cfm%22).
Have a good one.
Quote from: LimeJeeeephey guys ,just a follow up ..i purchased some inexepensive mirrors at camping world item #25855...they shake ,but not much...
http://www.campingworld.com/browse/skus/index.cfm/Outdoor-and-RV-Accessories/25855/skunum=25855:src=SRQB
they will surfice for now...BTW we are a hybrid owners now 04 travelstar 19ck
Those are the Cipa Strap on mirrors that I said were junk. I'm happy if they work for you. On my mirrors, they don't work the greatest and they fall apart. They shake a lot as you said, but I could still tell if there were cars around, blurry cars at that.:)
BTW, if I would ever go to a hybrid, it would be the 19CK as I think this is the best Hybrid out there. I just love the plan, weight, short length and all the living and sleeping area.
Have a good one.
Quote from: Mike UpAlso if your vehicle gets the mirror clipped, they don't give and you'll have a very nice dent or completely damaged door to repair.
Quote from: harleywolfHe just keeps the surfaces clean. I didn
Quote from: zamboniIf, while towing, I got close enough to clip my McKesh mirrors bad enough to hit the frame into something, then that something would ALSO cream my camper...
Glen, you discovered an unpublished added feature. They serve as warning devices when you're about to cream your trailer.
I have the McKesh mirrors and have used them on 4 TVs. They work well. I didn't have to buy new mirrors because I purchased a new TV. I have not had any problems with the paint on the door, but I do clean the doors and the pad that touches the door before installing the mirrors. I also purchased the convex mirrors that attach to the McKesh mirrors.:)
Quote from: AustinBostonI'm going to go a little off-topic and I am not trying to hijack the tread, but if you are not towing, or if you can use your rear-view mirror, you should NOT be able to see your own vehicle or your trailer in your side mirrors. Let me explain.
Like most people, for years I adjusted my side mirrors so I could just barely see my car in the mirror. Then, when I was on the highway, I was always careful to turn my head and check my "blind spot" before changing lanes. Then I read an article in a AAA publication that described what I did, and said it was very common, but completely wrong and dangerous.
There are three main problems with that method:
- There is still a blind spot. Unless you turn your head so far that your forehead touches the side window, there is an area you are not seeing by turning your head.
- When travelling forward, your head should not be pointing backward, it should be pointing forward. If something happens during that "glance over the shoulder" you loose significant reaction time, up to 1/2 second (about 45 feet or several car lengths at 60 MPH).
- There is a natural tendency, when you turn your head, to also turn the steering wheel. Most of us have learned to compensate, but we had to learn to do so; it is not natural. In addition, if you are trying to change lanes on a curve, even a gradual one, you probably still have issues with managing the steering.
What AAA said to do is to lean halfway to the window on the driver's side, then adjust to barely see your vehicle. Lean the same amount to the passenger side. They said it might take a few tries to figure out exactly how much to lean. When properly adjusted, the driver's side mirror will seem to be pointed off into some unexplainable space, and the passenger side will be more-or-less centered on the lane to your right.
Then just watch what you can see in the mirrors.
I was very surprised. There is NO blind spot. A car passing (on either side) is always clearly visible. I see a headlight appear in the side mirror the moment it disappears from the rearview. As the car passes me, even a small car stays in the mirror until the front of the car is right beside me. There simply is no blind spot, and I no longer need to take my eyes off of the road ahead to do the swivel-headed check before changing lanes.
One of the other benefits is that nighttime headlight glare from the side mirrors is reduced. The mirror doesn't reflect a passing vehicle's headlights at you until they are at a point where the headlights are normally pointed past you, not at you. This doesn't work for badly aimed headlights, but it does help with most vehicles on the road today.
Obviously, it does not work if you can not see over your trailer; in that case, you still need at least one mirror that can see behind the trailer.
Austin
Being somewhat of an experimenter and a die-hard trier-of-whatever-is-new-and-different, I immediately went out and re-adjusted my mirrors when I first read this. That was around a week ago, so I've had a good week to really try this out. At first it was very disorienting. When I would look into the mirror I couldn't see what I was used to seeing, and I had to fight the impulse to re-adjust back to normal. Then I began to observe what Austin described. No blind spot. Vehicles are always in view as they pass you. I began to like this!
Then, after a couple of days, I began to see some drawbacks. I'm used to using my side mirrors for backing up. They are no longer helpful for that. I suppose I could re-train myself for that if the benefits are as good as it seems. (You can't see the sides of your vehicle unless you lean way out to the left or to the right.)
Then something happened that made me decide to put the mirrors back to normal. This happened a couple of days ago, after I had become accustomed to the new technique. By "new technique" I mean not turning around to check my blindspot. (After nearly 40 years of driving, old habits are pretty entrenched.) Anyway, back to the problem. I began to shift lanes after checking the mirrors and seeing no problems. Then - whoosh - someone blows by me on the left! WTF!!!??? Well, this guy was simply going so fast that he was through my reflected line of vision too fast. Since I hadn't seen him in the mirror (too far back), I had no idea he was there. With the mirrors aligned this way they do not show the left lane of traffic all the way back. They only show a limited range. To truly eliminate the blind spot you need to first check your center rearview mirror, then your newly-aimed side mirror, then your peripheral vision. To go through that sequence quickly enough to see the super-speeder is just not practical.
I'm back to the traditional mirror alignment and turning to check the blind spots. I believe it is safer.
-Speak
Quote from: SpeakEasyTo truly eliminate the blind spot you need to first check your center rearview mirror, then your newly-aimed side mirror, then your peripheral vision. To go through that sequence quickly enough to see the super-speeder is just not practical.
I've been doing this for 5 years, not one week. I had this happen at first, because I was used to using only the side mirror. In the sequence you describe, it actually IS vary practical; a pasing driver is moving INTO the view as you check. I've done it thousands of times. You just forgot to check that rear view, because that part of the sequence is still new. I can make the check in under 1/2 second.
I would urge you to try it again.
Austin
Yea I tried it. Actually my mirrors are still adjusted as described but I can
I've tried both previously, not from reading a book but trying to eliminate the blind spot. What I do is adjust the mirrors ever so slightly where you can't see the edge of the vehicle on either mirrors, but a very small lean enables you to see.
If the mirrors are out of range where you can't see the edge of the vehicle, that's very bad when driving a truck that backs up and squeezes through small spaces. You need to see where your truck's sides are in relation to the obstacles your trying to avoid scraping. Also when backing up, I use the mirrors to see where the edges of the drive are as to keep my rig straight and in place.
I think that article is in error, because the blind spot can simply be removed by adding convex stick on mirrors, on to your main mirror. That's why trucks usually have a convex mirror in relation to their normal mirror or a small separately adjustable mirror in addition.
I am of the same thought as others, in saying that you create another blind spot that your unaccustomed to looking for. While it is small, I've had some slip in and surprise me in a very bad fashion. Also some people tailgate, where if the mirrors are further out, won't let you see them. The method I spoke of, that I use, seems to be the best of both worlds. When I pass, I do know where my blind spot is and don't need to turn my head completely. Just a little bit of a turn to look into the blind spot lets me pass safely.
After completely relying on my side view mirrors while driving class 7 rigs pulling construction equipment, you get a little complacent when driving a commuter car and tend not to move to look into that blind spot. You still need to, to pass safely IMO.
Have a good one.
I did buy the Tow-N-See Convex mirrors. They are on order so I'm expecting them soon. I have a broken ankle right now so camping is out of the question but once I have them, and use them, I'll comment on their usefulness. I've read so many excellent reviews on them and only 1 negative review where the mirror was probably so dirty, the suction cup wouldn't stick.
Hopefully these things are as good as most are saying. The convex mirror is really the one to use as the flat mirror is small and only offers a limited view. The convex mirror is reviewed as being excellent, giving a full view everywhere.
Have a good one.
Quote from: harleywolfAfter doing some more shopping around I am starting to lean towards the McKesh
My Tow-N-See Mirrors came in today and I've learned a lot.
First, because of the car design of my Pathfinder's mirrors, I'm limited on the length that all 3 mirror models can extend out, that being the Cipa Universal Mirrors, Cipa Strap On Mirrors, and the Tow-N-See.
All 3 mirrors extend out the same. All 3 mirrors have small surface area with the Strap on Mirrors the largest, the Universal Mirrors smaller, and the Tow-N-See Mirrors the smallest.
However the Strap On Mirrors and Universal Mirrors are flat and have limited viewing. I complained about this on other reviews with the Universal mirrors. However they were fine when used in conjunction with the vehicles mirror.
The Strap On Mirrors are the largest, but are the hardest to see because they vibrate and wobble so much. The view is always a blur, BUT you can see where objects are and that's what's needed to drive safely.
The Tow-N-See mirrors haven't been road tested yet, but I'll drive around with them on to see how they vibrate or lack of vibrating. I have the convex mirrors, I wouldn't recommend the flat mirrors at all for reasons I'll get into. I believe Tow-n-See seen the problems of the original flat mirrors and redesigned them with the convex mirror.
The Tow-n-See Convex Mirrors offer the largest and best view out of all. They cover so much area to the sides and vertically, that the vehicle's mirror is not needed at all. Now that's a good thing, because the vehicle's mirror can't be used at all. I had to adjust my mirrors very far in, pointing at the side of the truck with nearly no vision anywhere but the side of the truck. The reason is that the Tow-n-See mirror extension shaft must clear the vehicle's mirror's "BODY". To do this, the mirror has to be adjusted so that the mirror surface is flat and aligned with the body edges. Actually a bit above the body edges is recommended so that the Tow-n-See shaft doesn't rest on the mirrors body or lip. This isn't a problem with power adjustable mirrors, as the Tow-n-See mirror has a very large view, much larger than the 2 lanes you need to see. Having manual mirrors will be a bit frustrating when adjusting for the use of the Tow-n-See mirrors, then re-adjusting for the use of only the vehicle's mirror. The down side to this large view, is that it's set back as magnification is in reverse. The old saying is very true, "Vehicles are closer than they appear"! This demagnification on the mirror's glass is needed to get such a large view in such a small surface area. However, you see everything you need and this to me, makes this mirror much better than either Cipa Mirror mentioned.
The best design would be to have the Tow-n-See internal mirror glass moveable within the body, but it isn't and relies strictly on adjusting your vehicle's mirror glass. The reason may be that if more internals were added to the Tow-n-See mirror, it's weight would be greater, pulling more on the suction seal, either causing to fall more frequent or even causing a greater vibration effect.
With this this mirror, I can see all the way to the end of the camper, seeing it's last tail light. This wasn't true of the strap on mirror and I'd can't say with the Universal mirror since it's hooks were to small to accept the Pathfinder's mirror lip without paint damage. I made my review on the Cipa Universal mirror based on my experience towing with it on my previous 2004 Nissan Titan Crew Cab. Since it mounts to the back of the mirror and the Tow-n-See mounts to the front of the mirror, I was able to hold it on and compare it's extension with the Tow-n-See. That being equal extension as I previously stated.
I've had problems previously with the Cipa Universal Mirrors. Their foot cushions kept coming off. I finally had to Super Glue them on. I found out through the web this was a common problem. Many have used other industrial strength glues.
The Cipa Strap On Mirrors also are very unreliable. They have plastic clips that allow the straps to be adjusted. These crack easily, making the mirror useless. This happened within the first year. The straps also deteriate quickly, dry rotting at the edges where they crack and rip. These mirrors simply don't hold up, costing you a lot more in the end than more expensive tow mirrors.
For me, the clear winner is the Tow-n-See when using with a 7'1" wide Pop Up and my 2005 Pathfinder. This precludes the road test for vibration which I'm very hopeful after readings dozens of happy trailer travelers.
While I don't know for certain, the extension seems it would be also good for an 8' wide travel trailer but I'll have to cross that road, when or "IF" it ever happens.
For now, the Tow-n-See seems to be the perfect Pop Up Towing mirror.
Have a good one.
Forgot to mention, Cipa didn't update their Universal Mirrors. Their box picture actually has the mirrors pictured with a hook on the vehicles mirror lip that the universal mirrors DO NOT COME WITH! I only realized this when pulling the Universal Mirrors out of storage to compare with the Tow-n-See Mirrors.
Besides, I wrote Cipa an email over a week ago and not even a reply. This did not amuse me and I doubt I'll ever buy any of their products again.
Have a good one.
I just got done doing a driving test with the Tow-n-See mirrors up to 60 mph. I drove over rough and smooth roads. The mirrors behaved the same regardless of the road type.
The mirrors were very stable, absolutely no vibration that blurred the mirrors!! The mirrors do shake a little, probably less than the Cipa Universal mirrors. However everything is crystal clear. This by far is the best mirror I've used!
Doing the drive with the mirrors as extended as possible, worked much better than using my vehicle's mirrors. The mirror let me see the side of the Pathfinder yet going beyound the 2nd lane into the grass area! The vertical orientation allowed me to see the bottom of the Pathfinder's tire and allowed me to see the very top of the Pathfinder! Oh yeah, one side benefit, ABSOLUTELY NO BLIND SPOT! This is remarkable!
This mirror is very stable with a huge viewing area. I wish I would had bought them long ago. This mirror is fantastic!
Have a good one.