Newbie...need towing advice.

[DavidMSP]

Greetings Friends. Last year I posted and I was very grateful for all the advice.
Thank you so much.

I've finally reached some of my goals to be able to buy a pop up camper and move on to a new chapter in my camping life after over 20 years of tent camping. As I'm over 50 now so I look forward to getting off the ground...so to speak.

I've purchased a new '08 Nissan Xterra with a tow package that will tow 5,000 pounds. Now I've got the TV I need.

This summer I started looking at used pop ups. I was so surprised at just how "used" they were. I couldn't believe how these owners did not take care of their campers. Maybe I just didn't look enough ...but for the money I would have to spend to get a decent used pop up I might as well put that money towards a new unit. I didn't think I would be happy with any of the used units I looked at.

I started to look at new units and discovered how much more they cost than when I first looked two years ago. I found a good dealer who makes me feel comfortable but he's nearly 100 miles from my home. But I think this dealer will save me several hundred dollars and give me some peace of mind.

I'm looking at purchasing a Palomino P-2100. Total dry weight 1637. 13' 10" travel length. I got the towing package with my Xterra but I've never towed anything in my life that I owned. (I drove my Dad's van with his boat many years ago, a few times, and learned how challenging it was to back it up.)

The Xterra's ball is 2" in size and has a receiver pin and a safety pin. I have not yet installed the ball mount or the ball. When shopping at my local Wal Mart I noticed a lot of lock devices for towing mounts. Do I need to buy a receiver pin with a lock? How do I know which size is the right one? Of course with a new pop up I don't want anyone to steal it! Do I need a lock for my popup's trailer? I seem to recall a lock my Dad had on his boat trailer that would prevent anyone from being able to hook it up and drive away. Can anyone give me advice about what I need. I'll be afraid to leave my new camper at the park unless I know it's secured.

Of course the other thing I am concerned about is swaying while driving. I think I have chosen a good tow vehicle and a pop up of the right size for me and my TV. I don't usually travel over 200 miles when I go camping but I might in the future. Do I have reason to be concerned?
And, if someone could point me to some information about backing up a pop up camper so I can become more comfortable with that process that would be great.

Thank you all for your kind help and advice. If all goes well I will be picking up my new pop up this Friday and heading to a MN State Park for four nights of a new camping experience!  Hip hip hoooray!

[AZsix]

Congratulations on your new purchase.

Backing up with get easier the more you do it so don't sweat that. Just try to have someone behind you to guide you in. If using hand signals make sure you coordinate them before starting. Or you can get some walkie talkies and use them. Just remember to use gradual movements with the wheel and turn in the opposite direction that you want the trailer to go. If you are trying to go straight but see more of the trailer in one mirror more than the other, turn the wheel toward that mirror. I don't have a locking device for my receiver but a lot of people do. On the trailer there should be a tongue (don't know it's technical name) that you lower when hooked up and raise when unhooking. There should be a hole for a padlock in that. I highly recommend using one when you have the pup unhooked. I also put the lock in while towing so I know there is no chance of that popping up going down the road.

In my signature line you can see what I have and tow with and I don't have a problem with sway. My pup is 15'5" closed. Evenly distributing the weight when packing it will help with that.

You can't help but have a good time in a pup. Enjoy your time "off the ground"!

[PattieAM]

As your tow vehicle determines what you can safely tow and stop, you need those figures.  Then, check out the websites of the manufacturers for the various models within your weight range.  Look at the floorplans and amenities and think of future needs (health, family changes, etc).

Go view a few...lay on the bunks, sit on the potty, fake a shower, fake preparing a meal and see if the floor plan will work for you.

There are models with electric lifts (roof), which is something to consider if you have back issues.

PUPs with potty/shower are something to consider if mobility is an issue, as it sure is nice not to do the middle of the night -- toe stubbing trek to a buggy bathhouse.

AC and furnace are very nice amenities, and can extend your camping season and enjoyment.

Depending upon your hitch set up, weight, etc., you will most likely need a friction sway bar, but, a reputable dealership will tell you.  You will also need a brake controller depending upon the weight of the trailer....most PUPs have electric brakes.

You might not need the hitch lock, (I've been known to use a screw/bolt through the latch of the tongue), but it might make you feel more secure when towing....

As to backing the trailer up....take it to an empty school parking lot on a Sunday morning and practice backing into the bus lanes.  

If you are solo...you might consider purchasing a 'couple-mate' a V shaped thing that fits on your hitch and you back your tow vehicle carefully to the tongue, and the V will guide the tongue over the ball...makes hookup much easier.

[erich0521]

Good advice from the previous posts.  I think your Xtrerra will be fine for that camper.  Just to be sure, what is your GVWR (gross vehicle weight rating) of that camper?  

We have a 12ft box that gvwr is 2,700 lbs which is pretty light for a 12 ft box anymore.  We don't have furnace, and some other items that add weight.

The advice of spending some time inthe pup before you buy is good.  check it out, can you envision spending a full rainy day in there?

2 inch ball is probably right for most pop ups.

Go buy a good brake controller if yours has electric brakes.  Mine has hydraulic 'surge' brakes so I can't offer advice as I don't need a controller.

Towing will get easier with practice.  Take your time, don't follow too closely, etc. and you'll be just fine.  Also backing up while practicing in a parking lot is a good idea.  Gets very easy quickly in my opinion.

Finally do a few "camp driveways" in which you set up, spend a night outside, tear down, etc. before going on much of a camping excursion.  Gives you time to see what you might need, how to use everything, etc.

Finally, enjoy yourself!!  I love ours.

[MotherNature]

Don't underestimate yourself - practice makes perfect.  My boys would count how many tries it took me to back into our driveway spot.  I went from 30+ (yes, I did hit the house and dent the siding and downspout) to ONE (even though it took 3 years).  Have hope & good luck!

[tlhdoc]

When you are going to back up the camper put your hand at the bottom of the steering wheel.  Move your hand/wheel in the direction that you want the back of the PU to go.  I have my spotter use drivers side/passenger side instead of left and right.  There is a lag between when you turn the wheel in the car and when the PU will start to turn.  DO NOT OVER TURN THE STEERING WHEEL.  Small turns usually work better than large turns (they usually end up jack knifing the tv/PU).  I "wiggle waggle" when I back up.  Many small turns.  I rarely back straight.  When the PU starts turning it is time to make a small turn the other direction.  Take your time and don't get frustrated.  Have a great time with your PU.

[flyfisherman]

As you go forth into the camping world with your "new" PU and begin to experience the wonderful delights of backing into a camping site and plan to use your significant other as a spotter ... know this will do much to enhance your present relationship with that person!




Fly

[wavery]

Of course the other thing I am concerned about is swaying while driving. I think I have chosen a good tow vehicle and a pop up of the right size for me and my TV. I don't usually travel over 200 miles when I go camping but I might in the future. Do I have reason to be concerned?

You will find out about sway as soon as you tow your trailer at highway speed. Try towing at 45MPH and making a few lane changes, do the same at 50, 55, then at your maximum towing speed.

Before you start this test, be sure that the trailer is level front to back or even slightly down in the front, while hitched up. If the front is higher than the rear of the trailer, you can almost be assured of a swaying issue on most vehicles. Also be sure that your tongue weight is at least 10%-15% of the total trailer weight (it's a good idea to have the trailer weighed).

If the trailer starts swaying, tap your brakes lightly (set your break controller a little on the high side for this test). This will normally stop the sway immediately.

If the trailer sways at lower speeds than you normally drive, you will need to install a sway control device. If the trailer does not sway, the device is not needed.

[tverbryke]

Okay...don't laugh...but we actually unhook and push the pup into our site.  lol
It is light enough for the two of us to guide it into place, and we actually like to turn it sideways with the opening to the back of the site for more privacy and in order to have our awning/picnic table on the paved site pad.

[DavidMSP]

I am happy to report that all went well.
We picked up our new Palomino Pony P-2100 and spent four wonderful nights out camping at Camden State Park near Marshall Minnesota.
Backing up we just did a little trial and error, I didn't have time to try a parking lot first. It went well, once I discovered that it takes a little time and distance for the PU to respond to commands from the steering wheel of the TV.
And yes, the camper is light enough to be "directed" into final position by pushing, good advice!
The only trouble we had was understanding how the set up, leveling and stabilizing effected the fit and operation of the front door. Now we understand how when we were tent campers we often heard PU owners and their doors. We need to get a cheap plastic level to take with us to have more information other than visual to determine if we are level.
We just loved our first time out with our new Pony.
And we can't wait to go again.
Thank you to all of you for your help in what seemed like a long process to get to this place. It truly is a dream come true for us. We are honored to be a member of this site and the chance to get to know all of you.

[erich0521]

Good deal... I'm glad things are going well.  Let the fun begin!!

[wavery]

I am happy to report that all went well.
We picked up our new Palomino Pony P-2100 and spent four wonderful nights out camping at Camden State Park near Marshall Minnesota.
Backing up we just did a little trial and error, I didn't have time to try a parking lot first. It went well, once I discovered that it takes a little time and distance for the PU to respond to commands from the steering wheel of the TV.
And yes, the camper is light enough to be "directed" into final position by pushing, good advice!
The only trouble we had was understanding how the set up, leveling and stabilizing effected the fit and operation of the front door. Now we understand how when we were tent campers we often heard PU owners and their doors. We need to get a cheap plastic level to take with us to have more information other than visual to determine if we are level.
We just loved our first time out with our new Pony.
And we can't wait to go again.
Thank you to all of you for your help in what seemed like a long process to get to this place. It truly is a dream come true for us. We are honored to be a member of this site and the chance to get to know all of you.

That's great but did it sway :confused:

[daldricht]

Greetings Friends. Last year I posted and I was very grateful for all the advice.
Thank you so much.

I've finally reached some of my goals to be able to buy a pop up camper and move on to a new chapter in my camping life after over 20 years of tent camping. As I'm over 50 now so I look forward to getting off the ground...so to speak.

I've purchased a new '08 Nissan Xterra with a tow package that will tow 5,000 pounds. Now I've got the TV I need.

This summer I started looking at used pop ups. I was so surprised at just how "used" they were. I couldn't believe how these owners did not take care of their campers. Maybe I just didn't look enough ...but for the money I would have to spend to get a decent used pop up I might as well put that money towards a new unit. I didn't think I would be happy with any of the used units I looked at.

I started to look at new units and discovered how much more they cost than when I first looked two years ago. I found a good dealer who makes me feel comfortable but he's nearly 100 miles from my home. But I think this dealer will save me several hundred dollars and give me some peace of mind.

I'm looking at purchasing a Palomino P-2100. Total dry weight 1637. 13' 10" travel length. I got the towing package with my Xterra but I've never towed anything in my life that I owned. (I drove my Dad's van with his boat many years ago, a few times, and learned how challenging it was to back it up.)

The Xterra's ball is 2" in size and has a receiver pin and a safety pin. I have not yet installed the ball mount or the ball. When shopping at my local Wal Mart I noticed a lot of lock devices for towing mounts. Do I need to buy a receiver pin with a lock? How do I know which size is the right one? Of course with a new pop up I don't want anyone to steal it! Do I need a lock for my popup's trailer? I seem to recall a lock my Dad had on his boat trailer that would prevent anyone from being able to hook it up and drive away. Can anyone give me advice about what I need. I'll be afraid to leave my new camper at the park unless I know it's secured.

Of course the other thing I am concerned about is swaying while driving. I think I have chosen a good tow vehicle and a pop up of the right size for me and my TV. I don't usually travel over 200 miles when I go camping but I might in the future. Do I have reason to be concerned?
And, if someone could point me to some information about backing up a pop up camper so I can become more comfortable with that process that would be great.

Thank you all for your kind help and advice. If all goes well I will be picking up my new pop up this Friday and heading to a MN State Park for four nights of a new camping experience!  Hip hip hoooray!

Dear DavidMSP,
Here is hoping you took delivery of your popup and that you are no longer resting your bones on the rocks of a tent camping.
We joined the popup crowd over three years ago and know from looking in various places that you have to be very cautious about buying "used". Yes, many popup owners do not really maintain a popup - why I am not sure - they are not cheap by a long-shot when purchased new.
We got lucky - bought our 2002 Coleman Niagara with less than 13-months of use. Evidently the wife did not like NOT having a sink in the bathroom??? I know it is a long walk from the toilet/curtain area to the kitchen/area sink - but obviously this was more the husbands toy/enjoyment and the wife was looking for home creature comforts. Sounds like the wife should stay home with her sinks???
When I first read your heading of "Towing Advice" I was thinking of what to do if the popup had to be towed - like you have engine trouble on the vehicle that is hauling your popup - than what do you do when the tow truck takes your car/truck away and your popup is perched on the side of a highway with no one to protect you/it from walking away while you are gone.
We have joined AAA with a towing clause that says "if your car is disabled and you are hauling a trailer, we will tow that also to where the car is going?"
We have not had to use this extra towing service but came close this past weekend as we headed from VA toward a camping area in PA - the truck must have hit some sharp metal because we heard a real fast pop and was flat immediately. We pulled off to the side, called AAA, explained what we had need of and also emphasized my age of 63 plus having a dog stuck in the middle of a highway in 90 degree heat. We got out of the truck, with dog on leash, to stand away from the trailer and car for fear of some idiot not paying attention and driving at a fast rate of speed in the breakdown lane (we have all seen those video's on TV - and feeling them all go by at 70 to 75 mph only 2 or 3 feet away really does unglue me). I gave AAA a great compliment - the repair truck took only about 20 minutes to get to us (in the DC metroploitan area it is 1-1/2 to 2 hours before they get to you) and the repair guy was very fast. He also explained to me that if we ever got stuck with a major problem to the truck, they would have brought two tow trucks - one for our hauling vehicle and one for the popup. As I said, we have not actually had to use this service, but at least now I know that they really do tow both vehicles when you leave the side of the highway - kind of nice to know your $15,000 to $20,000 investment of leisure is not going to be donated to some slug with a trailer hitch. Even if you do have a ball/hitch lock, you can have your trailer hitch chained onto a thiefs tow bar to get it away from where you left it. Was thinking about doing car/road service with AARP, but think AAA has come up with a better reason I stay with them. Even though AAA is expensive, it is that one time that you need them that they pay for themselves in service.

[DavidMSP]

Thanks so much for sharing that information. As a newbie I need all the help and advice I can get. I am a AAA member (AARP too) and have AAA basic coverage for my tow vehicle. I have been considering adding their PLUS RV, which is the coverage I assume you are referring to. When "closing" on my purchase I learned that Palomino offers an emergency road side service for the first year included with purchase. I do have insurance on the PU with American Family and they also offered a road side assistance plan for only an extra $15 per year, but I declined since I have it with Palomino. I guess the $15 AMFAM wants is much cheaper than AAA's RV PLUS coverage but I have not compared them closely to determine exactly what is covered for the price. I'd hate to make my first ever claim on my auto insurance for this kind of event and then pay higher auto insurance for the next several years. I was also thinking about looking into the AARP roadside coverage and also the coverage offered by Good Sam. I don't know much about Good Sam and how they work. Since we're using just a PU, it seems expensive for us compared to a big huge RV. Seems like it should cost less for us. The other thing I learned about AMFAM coverage is that it is only offered for a 12 month policy, even though here in MN I only expect to use it 9 months of the year. Guess I need it to be covered even when it is in storage (outdoors). We do have hail and tornadoes here! Thanks again for your helpful advice. It was very nice of you to share your story to help a newbie like me.

[daldricht]

Thanks so much for sharing that information. As a newbie I need all the help and advice I can get. I am a AAA member (AARP too) and have AAA basic coverage for my tow vehicle. I have been considering adding their PLUS RV, which is the coverage I assume you are referring to. When "closing" on my purchase I learned that Palomino offers an emergency road side service for the first year included with purchase. I do have insurance on the PU with American Family and they also offered a road side assistance plan for only an extra $15 per year, but I declined since I have it with Palomino. I guess the $15 AMFAM wants is much cheaper than AAA's RV PLUS coverage but I have not compared them closely to determine exactly what is covered for the price. I'd hate to make my first ever claim on my auto insurance for this kind of event and then pay higher auto insurance for the next several years. I was also thinking about looking into the AARP roadside coverage and also the coverage offered by Good Sam. I don't know much about Good Sam and how they work. Since we're using just a PU, it seems expensive for us compared to a big huge RV. Seems like it should cost less for us. The other thing I learned about AMFAM coverage is that it is only offered for a 12 month policy, even though here in MN I only expect to use it 9 months of the year. Guess I need it to be covered even when it is in storage (outdoors). We do have hail and tornadoes here! Thanks again for your helpful advice. It was very nice of you to share your story to help a newbie like me.

Dave (or David?) Is the MSP Minneapolis for the airport code?
Seems like you have a lot of insurance.
Whatever insurance was offered when you bought the popup - will they be where you are traveling to? AAA is almost throughout all of the United States - whereas Palimono - would check the locations they would respond to. Call them and give them a 250 mile radius - if that is about the distance you would drive to camp on a weekend. If you have AARP maybe you can do 4 day weekends? If so, get a camping area that has WiFi for your computer and cable - and then you can stay connected. We both still work - but telecommunicate - so all we need is an internet connection and we can pretend we are still in the office.

I am not totally sure about AARP but I do not think they offered trailer towing - just the car/road service.

OK - with AmFam you mention having insurance - but that is just on the value of the car in the event of an accident? Right. Does that included roadside service of the car AND the trailer? I may be wrong but I do not think so.

AAAPlus is the only roadside service insurance that I know of for both car and popup. The God Sam club realy is for larger RV's. I used to own an older 27-foot RV and did the one year God Sam policy and NEVER found anything that was covered. The RV we bought really was a mess - someone had painted the window trim, thus clogging up the drain holes in the aluminum tracking. The windows used to drip during any rain storm. We had one incident partially covered when we discovered pine needles in the gas tank - clogged the filter - previous owner used the trailer to live in and was told he should leave the gas cap off so that pressure would not build up - but i WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHO THE NUT WAS THAT TOLD THEM TO PARK UNDER A PINE TREE??? We have a service truck come get us and tow us into the garage - about 45 minutes away - that was covered - but the $843 to remove the gas tank, drain it, refinish the inside of the tank and then put it back on was not covered.

And then we discovered that the tire rims were ruined by no brake shoes - literally metal was against metal and produced very deep grooves. That was close to $3,000 to redo.

You won't catch me ever wanting a large RV - it is a maintenance nightmare. We spend about $85 to have the popup "winterized" which is to basically blow out all fluids and fill with antifreeze - we have friends that do their system with vodka - then in the Spring when they start everything up again, the water tastes good rather than pink and funny???

In VA we pay about $106 for the AAAPlus for one card - I am always with Bill if we are camping so we did not need a card for each of us. We actually used AAA this past Friday for a blowout tire - so that one road service call has paid for itself. The fact that I was able to ask a AAA service man about the coverage - he made me slightly relaxed about the fact we can call for service of the car or the popup and BOTH VEHICLES are towed off the highway - they bring two tow trucks at the same time - so the popup is not left on the highway on its own. Considering all that is packed in every nook and cranny someone would get one heck of a stash of stuff - including microwave, 600-thread linens, pots/pans, etc.

Outside storage - I have created a 2x4 frame that sits on top of the popup roof  like a pitched roof  with four corner 2x4's that are on the outside of the camper and then we staple down a heavy canvas drop cloth first then a blue plastic or clear heavy plastic so that the blue crap does not detract from the house and use bungee cords to hold the plastic under the frame of the popup. If you can keep the fabric or plastic off the popup it will prevent condensation and then you will have to treat mold in the spring when you unwrap it. Plus covering the popup makes it so you do now have to scrub all of the exterior of the fiberglass as often. I good carwax on the exterior parts of the popup really help to keep it clean and in our case "white".

Tornadoes - just pray they do not come over your house. Can honestly say I was offered a very good job in OH - where I went to college - but I managed to live through a major tornado and would rather deal with hurricanes rather than tornadoes - the neighbors knew about the warnings, but I had the house packed, power shut off - so no A/C and had the radio packed - so was totally taken off guard as I sat in the upstairs 2nd floor bedroom window (wide open) wondering why the moving van was so late - and since when did we have trains in the area? He had heard about the tornado warnings and stayed out of the area. About 2 hours after the cone went through my back yard/service road and had lifted the roofs off my back-door neighbors, I was watching this whole thing as my neighbors popped up from below their basement walls. One woman yelled at me for being in a house that high up. I had all the windows open (for air) so the house did not implod, got the house packed two hours late but we had the only roof on our street. I managed to live through an earthquake in Lima Peru and that is even worse - so like the East Coast better than most - so far? The timber barn structure we are going to build on 20-acres in PA will have a storm cellar built under one quarter of the cement floor - and can use it for canned foods and in case of storms or terrorists? Believe it or not, living 30-miles from DC we constantly hear about chemical warfarefrom terrorist cells??? The three garage bay doors will allow the popup to be parked in the garage during the winter months.

If you enjoy camping, and even though you feel you can only get 9 months because of weather, you may want to keep an eye on Overstocked - the website - and find electric blankets on sale - and also get a ceramic cube heater - about $30 - and instead of using your own propane to heat the inside of the popup, you use their elctricity, which is included in your daily rate. If we run the propane heater, we go through a tank of propane in a day and a half. This might extend your actual time you can use your popup. The only thing you would have to be concerned about is a major snow storm? I like the fact you guys heat your sidewalks and a very large area is enclosed and above ground - tells me I would rather not have to deal with your winters. Was in Minneapolis several years ago and Northwest Airlines had us on the ground packed into the plane and 6 hours later managed to get a clearance to take off. The flight attendent tried to tell me I could not use the cell phone to call my mother-in-law and I basically said my kids were being looked after by an old couple and since I was held up by 6 hours BY HER AIRLINE she could take the complaint out the door. She did not even get the pilot - she just let us all use our cell phones.

The insurance policy that allows you to park it for the winter and lower your insurance bill - I THINK??? - is Good Sam and when I had that policy I think we paid about $260 or $285 a year - so paying $106 with AAAPlus and no decrease in winter month rates makes more sense to me!!!

Even when we move from VA to PA, we are more than likely going to be using the popup every month. There are many camping areas that are open all year - instead of the pool, they offer sleigh rides and hot chocolate. Seems like they are close to Lake Erie where it is definetly a place you could get snowed in if a storm comes off the Lakes. Good reason to have satelite radio/weather.

FAIR WARNING - find out all of the various sizes of fuses and go buy about 2 or 3 of each one - keep a box in the popup and when your microwave or coffee pot causes fuses to blow, you can fix right then. We also bought a rubber tackle box big enough to pack various tools into - hammer, screw drivers, electric tape, heavy duty tape - stuff that you can make-shift fix things with until you get home to have the popup serviced.

Hope this helps?
Dave