What s the point?
bearbait[:D] hang on, i gotta get my chair all situated just so.. there i got it, now for a drink, some popcorn........ok [8D]
ahhh, so good to have things back to normal [;)]
bearbaitwhew! I thought it was me...i just posted a private message to somebody else asking if she thought things were quiet or if it was because we have several different forums.
Now I ve had to start checking the product review and O/T ones...and I just saw SZQ is the last poster on the bargain emporium.....that woman has cost me beaucoup money! the pop-up screen room was the best one.
bearbaitMy view of this forum is different, I guess. I don t come here for entertainment or excitement value. I come here for info, which I get, quite readily. Right now, my camper is under 3+ feet of snow and I m in the middle of my tax prep service season. The activity of the board currently makes it easy for me to keep up on topics. And, with our other winter activities going on, my mindset is just not on camping right now. How many more threads can we start about the weather?Also, I don t find any redeeming value in watching members call each other names and bring each other down. Good natured, mature debate is always interesting.
I belong to one other board, but the speed and connection are so deathly slow that it makes it a real ordeal just to post there. I don t find much in content at the other board either- lots of chit chat and rehashed topics over and over.
I believe the board will become more active as we head into the spring and summer months. If it doesn t, it doesn t. Excitement value wasn t my reason for joining, so my point of view is what it is. I m more than happy to be here.
<Oh, hey and no inquires about where I DO go for excitement on the internet....[;)] >
bearbaitBairbait, don t get so down on yourself, most people don t care whether there are 500 members or 50. You shouldn t feel that it s up to you to perk up the board with this kind of drivel. I m sure you were just joking but some people might take it seriously. Good luck.
bearbaitLee, I see your point(s). Hopefully, others will read your post in the spirit in which it was presented. Discussion? Yes. Spirited? Perhaps. Flag-burning, in your face, take no prisoners and make no concessions radicalism? Not hardly. [;)]
One thing that may be a problem is how a person view s the different forums. With so many different places to post, it can be very hard to keep up with individual threads. You have to go to one forum, catch up, then another forum, catch up, post, then another forum, etc. By the time you get done, you ve forgotten to check one or two forums, and things can get lost.
Choosing the " Today s Posts" viewing option will only give you the last 50 posts. Same with the " Posts Since Last Visit" option, unless less than 50 messages have been posted since your last visit. I miss replies all the time that are posted during my work day. And a lot of posts by a particular club or group ( Nick-Neff-Cough in particular) can move other topics off the list in a hurry, possibly discouraging other members who have little interest in a California club s banter.
The " Most Active Topics" option will show threads that have been replied to the most, regardless of their relevancy to date. In other words, if we all posted to a thread about where we were going to camp on January 15th, and it received 100 replies, it would stay at the top of the list. That doesn t need to be there a month later. It seems an " Active *Topics* Since Your Last Visit" option would work better for many of us. This would also help insure questions get answered. Case in point: If a person doesn t visit the " Fix It" forum on a regular basis, a newbie s post on " Why doesn t my (insert noun here) work?" can go unanswered for a long time.
As for the member count, I don t know if that includes trial memberships and/or guests. Admin will have to weigh in on that issue. But every forum I ve ever looked at has more " members" than " posting members" , and more " posting members" than " active posting members" . Last I looked, PUT was still over 70% for a member/posting member ratio. That s not too bad. There will always be lurkers on any forum. If we want them to participate more, it s our job to make them feel welcome when they do finally post.
When you figure that this is traditionally a slow time of the year on the forum, it may explain part of the reason for a slow board. Like I said earlier, you ve made some good points. In the end, it s really not *how many we are*, but *how we help each other* that counts. I ll take a smaller group that helps each other over a larger group that doesn t any day.
(kicks box back to center of group for the next person)
Mmmmm... that smells good. Can somebody please pass the popcorn?
bearbaitToo early in the season for most of us to take any trips. I know most of my major trip planning was completed by Dec. for this coming summer. I went to the RV show at the end of Jan. and not all that much is happening in Feb. I m sure the board will start to heat up when people take their spring break trips, or take delivery on their new PU ordered at one of the shows. What attracts me to this board is the wealth of info shared by it s members.
bearbaitI have to agree that the PUT Forum just ain?t what it used to be. Back ?BC? (before the change) you could ask a question about camping or whatever and get all kinds of responses by folks willing to contribute their thoughts or experiences on the subject. Being something of a newbie I sought and got a lot of help from the PUT forum and really looked forward to getting back to the forum and seeing what others were saying in response to my questions or thoughts and in response to others. Also found that I could add ideas or experiences every now and then.
Lately, it seems there are not too many folks responding to things having to do with camping in general and PU?ing in particular. I have posted two or three questions having to do with camping in certain states or campgrounds and received little or no meaningful response. So, to find out how the response was on other boards I posted a question on PUT and then posted the exact same thing on PUX and iRV2 and, folks, PUX and iRV2 have it over PUT by a long shot. (And just in case you go looking on the other boards I?ve posted under names other than ?Wayfarer? as well as under Wayfarer.) While I still visit PUT as much as I do the other boards I am finding I get more meaningful help from the others. Seems on PUT we get a lot of threads where the same guys are just fooling around and throwing jibes at one another which, as someone above has pointed out, only serves to keep their threads on top and pushing other threads further down the page and out of sight. These threads, you may notice, usually have little if anything to do with camping. I fear PUT may have created a Mutual Admiration Society. Hope not!
I?ll hang in and where I can contribute to the ?cause? as far as camping is concerned and hope things improve over time and make it worth my time to renew when the time comes.
bearbaitI believe in quality and not quantity. I know that I am the second most poster on the PUT boards (since the changes), but I also see that the last 10 posts by bearbait were made over the last 10 days. One post a day is hardly the way to involve yourself in this site. I sometimes have senseless or non-camping posts, but I try to include my opinions on the topics presented on this board. The camping posts will come as it is still February, and most people who participate on this forum will not be camping until March, April or May.
I do see part of your point, and that is that this board is not quite as active as it was before the " change" , but I am not surprised and you shouldn t be either. Not everyone agrees with or is willing to pay for this priveledge. I feel that this is a good and friendly place. If you don t feel the same way, then maybe it is time for you to move on. Nobody is forcing you to post here or stay here.........the only reason I am stating that is that this place has been a friendly and family like site. If you don t feel like you are part of the family, then I hate that you feel that way. It would probably be more constructive if you posted in a more freindly manner..... but that is just how I approach things....
bearbaitI m just curious as to how many posts you need to make per day, to be " involved in this site" ?
bearbait*SIGH* Some folks just aren t happy unless there is conflict of some sort going on. Who really cares if there are 500 charter members, members or trial members? I like the folks here and I would be here if there were only 20 members. I paid my money and have the right to post or not to post and don t have to give reasons for doing either, nor do I expect anyone else to have to give reasons for posting or not posting. I like the campfire forum and it is the reason I decided to stay with PUT.
And that s all I got to say about that.
Trlrboy[:o]
bearbaitLee,
First of all I hope your post does not cause anyone to flame you. I don?t think it?s drivel, actually far from it. It was well thought out and addresses several themes that I can identify (maybe more). The issues I see you raising are:
[ul]
- The number of Arvee Members
- Members posting at multiple sites, possibly reducing the value of the PUT boards
- Apparent lack of club related benefits
[/ul]
The number of Arvee Members Yes, there are 500 members on this board. But as other have pointed out those numbers can be misleading at times. They do include 2 member households and trial members. Two members households are a minor number of the memberships (fewer than 20). Less than 100 trial memberships have been given out, and over 10% of them have converted to full memberships. On the last board before we switched, we had close to 5000 members but fewer than 400 posted multiple times. When you got down to who posted more than 50 times you were well less than 50 people. The numbers can be confusing, and this happens at every board. Additionally, we don?t delete trial members if they choose not to join because; just like the old board that then leaves posts out there with no author name. It ends up more confusing trying to figure out who said what.
Members posting at multiple sites, possibly reducing the value of the PUT boards
All of here at PUT never thought that this would be the only place on the web for folks to post about pop up camping. Multiple sites provide additional exposure to our chosen recreational activity, which I see as a positive for the pop up industry.
Additionally, through the years of the previous boards many friendships developed between members of the boards. When our site changed, some people chose to post other places. Many of our current members also visit other sites to continue those friendships as well as to see what else is happening out there. If a question happens to be posted on another board and one of our members has an answer for that person it is only right that it get answered.
Apparent lack of club related benefits causing the ?natives to be restless? I must admit, I really haven?t seen this attitude. Obviously, the value of a membership is going to be different to different people because what they see as benefits is going to be different. You are correct in stating ?How many sets of tacky lights, t-shirts, bunk end covers and paha que tents does each member need??.
The first benefit I think most members agree on is the ability to have a space dedicated to pop up camping with sufficient resources to make participation enjoyable. This was the main reason PUT decided to go to a pay site format. Due to the costs associated with the site PUT had two choices:
1. Switch to a pay/membership site
2. Discontinue the boards entirely
Compared to the other sites out there, PUT is a business. If it doesn?t pay it?s way it goes away. The other boards freely admit that they loose money and are looking for ways to support themselves. While it is a laudable goal to try to provide the services free of charge, there still needs to be sufficient funds to support a site with sufficient Internet resources. As kathybrj stated about another site ?I belong to one other board, but the speed and connection are so deathly slow that it makes it a real ordeal just to post there.?. This is what I see as one of the main benefits of membership. Other benefits have been announced, and others are n the works. I can only say I trust Dave at this word that he will make it worth the money.
Now my opinion of the state of affairs here I must admit that when PUT made the decision to change formats I thought the site was dead and I told Dave so. When I saw how many people signed up immediately I began to believe it could survive, but would take a while to get back to it?s old self, I thought about a year. I now think that sometime this summer we will have regained most of the regular camping related postings. The feel of ?home? has already returned and I look forward to a more positive attitude.
Voicing concerns No one should feel uncomfortable voicing concerns regarding anything that goes on here. If someone does not feel like posting a comment on the board, Dave, Steve and I get lots of e-mail each day and would welcome peoples thoughts of the direction we are taking.
bearbaitOk, I sort of feel that some people might not be happy with the chatter/blabber going on in the campfire forum.
As I am not an actual camper (spritiually I am), I stay at campfire unless I can add any value in the General forum. I post a lot in campfire. I think, campfire is what it is, a campfire where we talk, chat & have fun. I think as the camping season is not there yet, that s why most members are idling away there as well. I know we lost a lot of emmbers but, I remember, last year these months it was slow too (If my memory is not misleading me).
Now that I justified my endless chatter there, I will keep quiet [:D] I hope I am not irritating anybody at campfire.
For me, PUT is home, I learned a lot here, I still have lots of friends here (even though I miss quitea few of them) and I will probably stay PUT (pun intended [;)]) until I am banned or something worse happens.
Birol
bearbaitBearbait, I wonder how far back you go with PUT? I have said MORE THAN ONCE that back on UltrBoard we had not as many members active as we do EVEN here, and the post numbers for each day were small. NO BODY CARED!! We were a close-knit group. and this closeness is what made PUT a success, not huge numbers of hit-and-run newbies asking constant and repetitive questions although we always welcomed them. Some asked their questions and left, and others joined in and added greatly to the fun and the bonds which made the board what it has become today.
As someone pointed out, there are varied reasons for belonging here. BARGAINS and DISCOUNTS were NOT among mine nor was having lots of posts everyday just chock full of information. I know that if I ask a question here, someone will answer it. (Actually thanks to past expperience AT PUT I have few, if any, off-season questions.)
Like birol, I am here because I love camping and outdoor life AND the kind of people who hang out here. It IS a kind of cyber-home for some of us and for me it is worth the fee. And as kathy said, if there were only 20 members here, I d still continue to pay my money.
Having said all that, I dont take offense at your post and think you have raised some legitimate concerns in this thread. Your remarks have given the administrators and members issues to ponder which will make the board a more effective and useful place because it calls into question for all of us WHY WE STAY HERE when there are several really good and informative free sites out there. I dont think anyone is stupid enough to believe we have 500 paying members, but still, that number does prove that there are 500 people interested enough in PUT to sign in.
I dont think your remarks deserve to be flamed by ANYONE and hope we have all grown beyond that. Seems like it is the WHY of our memberships that is at the center of ypur concerns. You obviously expect other things from this site than several of the rest of us. And it is very good that you have pointed out this difference because for some " purists" I am sure the new PUY Board is a disappointment. And if PUT cannot meet their needs, they will leave.
This thread gives Dave and his staff the opportunity to examine where they want this board to go. If it doesnt exist for profit, then what exactly do they see as its mission? Perhaps they want to encourage an interest in popup camping and at the same time, to create (as they have very successfully done) some very warm cyber-friendships between people of varied types who live in different parts of the country, have different jobs and incomes, are of different ages, religions, ethnic backgrounds, and experiences. This is NOT a bad thing in a world which is now torn by hatred and divisiveness.
NightOwlNightOwl,
Noone could have said it better! I knew I liked you from the first time I read about how your cat peed in the sink!
I learned a lot from the old board (and from Dave) and expect to learn a lot from this one as well. If the value of membership is based on how much we can contribute -- I can contribute very little because I am new to this business and have too much to learn. In the meantime it is interesting to get a feel for who the heck these people are that love popupping! Most of them sound like people I would like to get to know better.
For a short while I was a member of a board started by a disgruntled participant of the old PUT board and take my word for it -- it s more interesting and upbeat here!
bearbaitThis is only MHO, but I was really kinda relieved when the numbers on the board went back down into the hundreds rather than the thousands. It s great, sure to think that we are part of something that so many other people think is so neat, just like we do. But don t you remember how confusing things got sometimes, with several identical posts all going on at the same time, or people who didn t have time to read all the posts in the thread so they just addressed the matter from the perspective in the first post, and then it had evolved to something else by then? Do you remember how fast the thread that you really wanted everyone else to see and comment on would disappear to the next page, and you had to constantly bump things to bring them back? For me, the world travels fast enough already, and when I want to relax with my friends and camp, I want to be able to kick back and put my feet up while I do it, not be hurrying and scurrying to cover all bases. I like the board the way it is. Right now, we aren t camping here in MI, and our FLA vacation turned out to be a little different than we had originally planned, so I may not be saying much about camping. But, I m reading and watching and listening, and when spring rolls around I ll have plenty more to post on the general forum.
T
[;)]
bearbaitWell ya can t really blame Bearbait.
He is just like many of us.............
Back when the boards were real busy, we all basically gave up our regular lives to read Pop Up Times. And now when things are slower it s hard to find other things to fill in the gaps. So hopefully things will be busy again someday, so we can go back to reading PUT full time again.
bearbaitYou all make good points.
Here are some numbers about our membership -
paid memberships=401
RV makers/adverters=17
admin/moderators = 8
the rest are spouses and trials.
The number of posts since Jan 1 are amazing, this is a very active board. I don t think there are as many non-sense posts and battles between members now so maybe it s not as spicy as it was. I also like the new software.
We re looking for more new products for the store. We test every product we sell for quality, availability and general usefulness before we offer them. Some aftermarket manufacturers / distributors insist that we carry large inventories, more than we can sell. For instance, I don t think we could sell $800 worth of little $5 stick-on levels, so we re looking for better deals on that type of stuff. I want the club member savings and quality to be a good reason for you to join and stay.
We re always open for suggestions.
Dave
dave@popuptimes.com
800-398-8893
bearbaitBearbait / Lee,
I d like to address some of the things you stated in your reply to me...
QuoteI m a little miffed as to Gamecock Camper s post as I think he was aiming that at Wayfarer more than me anyway. But somehow he said that he believe s in quality not quantity, then flames me for only making 10 posts in 10 days? Then he goes on to say how friendly this board is and how it s like family, then turns around and says " get out!" Boy, that s pretty friendly don t you think? And exactly where in my post did I say I was upset with anyone that makes a lot of posts?
First, I wasn t aiming at anyone in particular. I was just trying to make general observations.
Second, I think quality is in the eyes of the beholder. I enjoy this site and think highly of most of the members here. Quality to me includes the many senseless and entertaining non-camping posts. The camping stuff is great, but the other topics are just as valuable and entertaining to me. Another point I d like to make is that I was the person who initiated adding a forum for Product Reveiws.... and that is camping related. I hope you add to that forum and learn from it.
Third, I was not trying to " flame you" for making only 10 posts. If you have camping related questions, please post them as I think we can all benefit from discussions about camping, pop-up campers, etc... I d welcome it.
Fourth, again, you didn t really say that you were upset with anyone who makes alot of posts. I was trying to point out that I am one of the people that contributes alot to the non-camping related topics. I don t know what I was thinking, I was just typing madly because I was not as upset with your message as I was at the tone of your message. It did not come accross as constructive and did not offer any solutions.... it just seemed to be posted for the sole purpose of stirring things up. I may be totally wrong, but that is how I see it. I wouldn t be surprised if others saw it that way too.
Fifth, I guess you can read whatever you want into what I said. I think life is too short to do things you don t enjoy. I never told you to get out. I won t tell you what to think or post or to stay or to leave. Heck, you have a membership and the priveledges that come with it just the same as anyone else. You can stay, leave, just lurk, whatever. I d much rather discuss camping and other topics at a more friendly level. It seems difficult for me to think that you wouldn t expect to stir things up a bit when you say, " So let the flames to this thread begin... " Because I see this type of thread as stirring the pot, I will not post any additional replies to this thread. I d like to appologize to you if you were offended Bearbait. Peace to you brother.
NightOwl
QuoteORIGINAL: NightOwl
As someone pointed out, there are varied reasons for belonging here. BARGAINS and DISCOUNTS were NOT among mine nor was having lots of posts everyday just chock full of information.
Bargins, and Discounts??????
This board has cost me, Big time...
Fridge Fan, Lynx Levelers, BAL Leveler, Better Charger, Cordless drill....
I d be money ahead to stay away, But I can t.
MtnCamper..another related note:
" The old board / archives"
What brought me to PUT in the first place was all the information it contained. I spent as much time searching the old board as I did reading new posts.
That s where this board falls short. It s empty.
If I was a new camper and wanted to know why my ABS cracked I d have to ask and wait (maybe for days) for answers. And I would only get a small number of replies. Searching wouldn t prove to be very helpful as of yet.
Would I join?
Now what if I did a search and received two-dozen hits? Would I join?
Things will get better here, but we may never have the wealth of information we had on the old board.
I think I read 10% of our trial members decided to join. That s not very many.
What if we had the old messages available here? Trial members would be able to have more information than they could possibly read on any topic imaginable.
Would that change the 10% to 60%?
What if we marketed this board as a pop-up camper research tool? We already have all the answers - just bring questions.. Hey, I pay $40 a year just for an online hi-fi blue book.
Remember, this is a business. And the more new members we have the better for Dave, the better for the board and the better for us.
Anyone have any thoughts?
*****
BTW Dave, if you ever take down the old board I *will* hunt you down![;)]
MtnCamperBearbate is concerned about the small number of actual members of the board and the slowness with which it moves. Here is some information which I hope will cheer him (and all of us) up
So, Friends, TAKE HEART! The following figures took very little time to come up with, but they give a picture of what has been happening to this new board.
A little checking reveals
we have now got slightly over
ten thousand, eight hundred and thirty seven posts
These were all done within the seven weeks (forty nine days) this new board has existed.
This averages out to two hundred twenty one posts per day.
The General forum (dedicated to camping topics) has 328 posts, Mr Fixit has 82, and Campfire has 312. This is not a bad ratio for the dead-of-winter.
These figures would seem to indicate that the PUT board is not exactly in danger of perishing from insufficient traffic as BB fears.
I agree with Toni s remarks here--the board has actually benefited from having smaller numbers of members. We now have the time to get to know each other better and to read all the threads before they zip back 5 pages before the end of the day. THAT WAS RIDICULOUS! and it did NOT necessarily mean the board was a better place for camping info or anything else.
and we need to keep in mind that the numbers of posts are scattered about through FORTY FORUMS NOW. Plus, the old board did not just suddenly acquire a whole archive of campground reviews and product critiques and other useful camping info.
That plethora of useful posts all took time to build up. I doubt seriously whether ANY board THE AGE OF THIS ONE NOW has offered much more than can be found here at SEVEN WEEKS!! [:)]
MtnCamperhttp://www.popuptimes.com/forum/forum.asp?FORUM_ID=2&CAT_ID=3&Forum_Title=General
Now, if I did this right, which all of you know is a real gamble, this should be the link to the archives. If I didn t get it right, will someone else please post it for jdr?
T
[;)]
MtnCamperYou were close. This is what I use:
http://www.popuptimes.com/forum/default.asp
But that wasn t my point. Why let all that go to waste when we can use it here? Wouldn t that entice many more new users to this forum? Would that help the 10% sign up rate increase?
Yes, we have a good number of messages here. But please, let s be real. Do a search here then repeat the search on the old board and you will see what I mean.. It s all there. Why not put it here?
And again, I m not saying there is a problem here but all that valuable information really is worth something. Why not have it work for PUT?
jdr
QuoteORIGINAL: jdr
Why let all that go to waste (the archives) when we can use it here? Wouldn t that entice many more new users to this forum? Would that help the 10% sign up rate increase?
And again, I m not saying there is a problem here but all that valuable information really is worth something. Why not have it work for PUT?
JDDR, you are ABSOLUTELY RIGHT about having our archives available easily--there is a mountain of useful information available in them and I didnt mean to imply that what we have now is nearly as comprehensive. Like you, I wish there would be a way to integrate them more quickly/easily into the new board but someone smarter than I am about computer stuff will have to make that decision IF it is even possible to do such a thing.
MtnCamperI don t think it would be possible (integrate), you are dealing with 2 different and non-compatable software companies. It s as good as it gets now.
MtnCamper
QuoteI don t think it would be possible (integrate), you are dealing with 2 different and non-compatible software companies. It s as good as it gets now.
Don t confuse easy with possible. Anything is possible - nothing is easy.
Look at it from a business standpoint.
1. How many new members would it take to pay for the integration?
2. With the integration in place, how many extra members would sign up?
3. How does #1 compare to #2?
It may be a dumb idea, but it is a positive suggestion that may help increase our 10% sign up rate.
NightOwl[:D]
MtnCamperLee, you poor dear, arent you getting a little touchy? I just did what you said you are going to do to me--I stood up for a different point of view from yours and simply asked how long you had been around the old board NOT as a way of putting you down, but because I wondered if you were there when there were only a few dozen members and so that you could recall the days when the membership was much smaller than it is now and SEE? It grew just fine! [:)][:)][:)] (And we were too dumb to worry about this at the tjme)
My remarks were NOT intended to inflame you because as I said, your different point of view on this brought up some interewsting ways of looking at the new board and hopefully caused Dave and crew to consider more widely how they want to help it grow. .
Furthermore, I dont care what the people said who sent you e-mails complaining about me--if they dont have the guts to do it in public, then their opinions dont count.
I dont have a thin skin, so rave on if it makes you happy. It will be good for the board to have a little excitement.
Also, this is the campfire forum so we dont have to stick closely to threads dedicated merely to camping....you seem to think I am complaining about something having to do with this, perhaps in your zeal to stand up for yourself you have misread something I wrote.
PS Someone else appointed me the den mother here--I just accepted it.
And I was not trying to psychoanylize you--I will leave that to your psychiatrist[:)]
jdr
QuoteORIGINAL: jdr
QuoteI don t think it would be possible (integrate), you are dealing with 2 different and non-compatible software companies. It s as good as it gets now.
Don t confuse easy with possible. Anything is possible - nothing is easy.
Look at it from a business standpoint.
1. How many new members would it take to pay for the integration?
2. With the integration in place, how many extra members would sign up?
3. How does #1 compare to #2?
It may be a dumb idea, but it is a positive suggestion that may help increase our 10% sign up rate.
Joe, another hangup may be, that the Snitz forum is a free format, this isn t. If you intergrated from that board to this one, Maybe a problem. I don t know.
MtnCamperOK, that s the end of the sniping back and forth at each other.
Bearbait has raised legitimate issues, which all of here at PUT should take seriously ( I know Dave, Steve & I do). It is the goal of Pop Up Times to promote pop up camping ? pure & simple. While we all enjoy the light personal off topic posts, it can very easily begin to appear to outsiders that we are nothing more than a closed clique.
Elisa,
Even I could read the sarcasm in your replies in both this thread, and others, which you replied to. Let?s go back to our childhood, if you don?t have something nice to say don?t say anything.
MtnCamperI agree with Lee on everything he has said, and I will proudly stand beside him. Perhaps everyone else who feels the same, should chime in, and maybe, just maybe, we can make a change!
MtnCamperSorry, I don t agree. I was e-mailed not to long ago by the moderator s questioning why I feel the way I do about PUT, and I was very honest and upfront. Nothing ever stays the same, change isn t bad, or wrong. There are many, many, many members with huge attitudes, and it is off putting to others! Sorry, but it s true. You honestly don t think new membes are put off by comments of " the old board, and PUT just got so big, we re all family, the references to trolls, the so called self appointed moderator s and defenders" ? I do, I think it makes a very unfriendly board, no matter how many times, ya all say how friendly and open you are. I paid my membership and that of another s because I want this board to be a success, but I think (my opinion) issues need to be resolved. It s not high school, but it sure feels like it 60% of the time. I m sorry but I personally am more comfortable elsewhere, and that s pretty sad as I ve been a member for quite some time. Sorry....
bearbaitPersonally I think this isa great place for information and I appreciate the lack of " flames" . As a matter of fact as soon as I see a flame in a message, I stop reading and move on.
I have rec d valuable information on every question I ve raised and have tried to honestly answer any questions that I could.
I have no need to visit the other sites, free or not, as this one fulfills my needs, so why look further.
MtnCamperYou guys are not going to believe this.
I just went to the ASPPlayground site. Right on the front page under " Software Features" is " Snitz Conversion Script"
It may cost nothing at all..
http://forum.aspplayground.net/tm.asp?m=374249&appid=0&p=&mpage=1&key=&language=&tmode=&smode=&s=#374249
QuoteBACKGROUND
----------
convertSnitz.exe will convert Snitz topics/replies to ASPPlayground format and
update member profiles converted from Snitz to ASPPlayground pgd_members table
using Chris Kaminski s (HomeNetHelp.com) .SQL script so that they work with
the client-side message parsing used by ASPPlayground. I took Chris ASP-based
message conversion script and modified it to work within an EXE file so that
timeouts were not an issue when converting larger Snitz Forum s to ASPPlayground.
I converted over 48,000 posts and updated over 18,000 members profiles using this
tool, so it does work.
MtnCamperWell, I like the board the way it is now. I can read most of the posts on a daily basis & keep up with what s going on around the country. The 7 pages of general topics a day, on the last board, were ridiculous. One day I counted 6 different people having started the same topic on the first page. In fact, the archives are filled with the same stuff over & over. It got to the point that people were saying it was ok to continuously ask the same questions. Maybe they have no lives and liked giving the same answers over & over, but I for one just gave up reading & responding to them.
The archives are very easy to access. Go to the top of any page & just click on " Old Forums" and do your search. There s nothing magical about accessing them and no special links are necessary. I refer to them all the time and am glad they re there. I see no reason to " include" them directly into the current forums when they re so easy to access.
I also am not concerned with the " current number of members" . I signed up at another board & made two posts (back in December). If I knew how to delete myself from it I would. But, in the meantime, they have 1 more member on their rolls who doesn t care what happens to them. Guess I m the Toolman Tim of his board. He posted ONE post on this board in 10 days & it was to tell us he was leaving & where he d be going. A very thoughtful and helpful thread to any newbies needing assistance with their new popups! Glad he thought enough of PUT s letting him in free for 10 days to participate in the forums and give us some of his sound advice.
When we went from ultraboard to coolboard, I told Peggy that I had read every thread made on both forums. She shook her head & said I was nuts. Well, I was nuts until around March of 2001 when there was a massive influx of people who began asking redundant questions every day causing the number of daily pages to grow beyond ones capability of reading in a couple of hours a night. Is that what people want to again happen? Does that fit some profile of a " successful" message board? And, it was one member who began the Coleman bashing & had his buddies come over & do the same. Great reading, but personally I wasn t impressed. If there s a popup problem, then this is a great place to let it be known. But, I don t need hateful & threatening posts shoved in my face every day to get the point. And don t think for one minute that the other manufacturers don t have problems with their products too.
Very few have posted questions to which there isn t a response. But hey, if you don t know the right answer, why post a bunch of jibberish? Look in the archives or at those other boards and the dribble & hijacked threads will make you laugh. It wasn t all wine & roses on the last board & never will be here. This is a message board which gets its topics and responses from real people. Diversified ideas and opinions are great to read and ponder. I m glad there are many who have made lasting friendships here and hope there will be many more.
And, there s no reason for members to make snyde remarks to or about one another. Perhaps it s time for everyone to apologize to everyone else, have a group hug & get on with living. So, as it s past my bedtime, " I APOLOGIZE TO EVERYONE, BEG YOUR FORGIVENESS AND HERE S A BIG HUG" ! [;)][&:]
bearbait
I believe it s time for everyone to take a chill pill
[/color]
MtnCamperI had replied to this thread, in the form of a reply to Bikolee. I saw it for a second and it disappeared.
Anybody saw it ? Did it get deleted ?
I would like to know why it was thought fit to be deleted please ......
What millertyme said, I also apologize if it were nasty, but I don t think it was.
MtnCamperOne of my posts was booted too. Don t know why, I wasn t being nasty.
If I was, I apologize. My bad.[;)]
MtnCamperThere is a bunch of them missing.[:@]
I think it is because someone deleted their own post again.
On this new software if you reply to someone s post and then someone else reply s to yours and so on and so on. If the first person decides to delete their own post then the whole chain gets deleted.[: (]
It happened on the Nantucket thread, I think it happened again here?
Either that or they were just deleted? There seem to be some new rules about sarcasm? so maybe they felt we broke that new rule?
Jeffrey
QuoteORIGINAL: Jeffrey
Either that or they were just deleted? There seem to be some new rules about sarcasm? so maybe they felt we broke that new rule?
Nope & Nope
No we did not delete them and no, there are no new rules
MtnCamper
QuoteWhat bothers me is that as members contribute elsewhere on the net, it has taken the quality away from this board, and that s sad to see.
This has me concerned too - I checked out another board. What I saw though was that new people were able to more easily access the info which comes from being a free site. So there are more postings, more questions even if they are rehashes of past ones. There are always people who are new to camping and wanting info. Unfortunately with PUT being a pay site, a lot of those newcomers are eliminated because it is new to them and they aren t certain they want to spend the money. I personally am not the kind of person that will try something for ten days. Either I skip it from the start or sign on from the start.
I m not sure if I ever would have really gotten into PUT as soon as I did, had PUT been a pay site from the start. And, yes, I gladly paid to stay on because of having had the opportunity to learn more about PUT and the people here. But I can see where membership will be a tougher issue. I also think opening the Arvee Club Membership area would be a good idea to let folks see more of what goes on in this site.
As for the posts now being made - they don t seem to have the content they did before. But I know for me, not being able to do any mods in the winter and not actually camping, now really limits what I have to say or ask. I have no doubt once I am back on the road, towing to my heart s content, I ll have plenty to ask!
And I would think a reason why there aren t too many Mr. Fix It posts would be that most of the people on this site are the ones who often had the advice to those more like me who are still new. It would be interesting to see how long most folks here now have been camping and how long in a popup.
I m not trying to make excuses for the quietness of the board. I d like to see it perk up a bit too.
I have been thinking a lot about what Lee wrote throughout these posts and have to say I agree with it. But, other than give it time and find a way to promote the site to more first time poppuppers, I don t think there are a whole lot of answers. Without first timers to ask questions, it s rare you ll see many asked, other than the " what do you keep your clothes in?" or the occasional mod question asked. There is a lot of knowledge on this board, but not too many ways for it to be exercised just now. The quality is still here too. It s just quiet now.
Of course, if ya want, I can always post about camping fantasies involving Spam! [;)]
Just my 2 cents.
whippetwrun
QuoteORIGINAL: whippetwrun
This has me concerned too - I checked out another board. What I saw though was that new people were able to more easily access the info which comes from being a free site. So there are more postings, more questions even if they are rehashes of past ones. There are always people who are new to camping and wanting info. Unfortunately with PUT being a pay site, a lot of those newcomers are eliminated because it is new to them and they aren t certain they want to spend the money. I personally am not the kind of person that will try something for ten days. Either I skip it from the start or sign on from the start.
This is why we have the free trial period, but is there more we can do?
These are the things we are looking for.
Jeffrey[:D]
JeffreyI thought that once there was a post, one couldn t/shouldn t be able to delete his/her own post. Probably it is an option or a bug ?
JeffreyMy mail to moderator1@popuptimes.com Bounced back .....
Final-Recipient: rfc822;moderator1@popuptimes.com
Action: failed
Status: 5.3.5
JeffreyWell, it looks like another thread fell victim to the delete my post button. Maybe this feature could be disabled untill the bugs are worked out of it. One can always edit out what they want to without deleting and destroying threads.
Maybe with some serious thought and consideration we can all come up with some good ideas to help keep the board moving in a forward direction. Lee brought up some valid concerns for us all to ponder.
But in the end, it is US that will make the difference.
JeffreyWhen this thread got started, I would agree that Bearbait had some very good points for us to consider, but from my perspective, it seemed like it was posted in quite an aggressive style. It lost it s constructiveness with it s in your face kind of attitude. But, a few folks did try to understand what he was saying and posted very good thoughts to the points he made. Unfortunately, they may have misread his meaning and things got off on another track completely. After that, it was every man (or woman) defend themselves. For some reason, things that were totally uncalled for were said, and remarks that were completely off the wall were made. Every time there is a thread that becomes either heated or controversial, someone makes remarks about high school and cliques. However, any time there are more than two people who have a lot in common and think a lot of one another, could be considered a clique. What are ya gonna do, prohibit personal friendships? Let s try to stick with the original content of the thread, and see if there really is something constructive that we can do about the questions raised by Lee.
Toni
bearbaitI think most people are in consensus with Bearbait s questions, the board has been a bit slow, and when I see the # of members, I have wondered why there isn t a lot of activity. I don t interpret it as a negative thread, just something to think and ponder. I ve noticed it at other forums too. Could be due to people being out and about camping, or just getting into their lives in general. If you look at other campfire forums...they do seem to divert people from the general topics. I try to make sure I look at the campground reviews and general popup threads and not just come to the campfire. Hopefully when spring has sprung there will be many more people actively contributing to the forum as the camping season revs up!!!!
JeffreyThe board is a bit slow because a lot of us are under anywhere from a few inches to a few feet of snow/ice. As far as the delete button goes, I firmly believe it should stay. There have been more than a few times that I have responded to a post, only to want to delete it. Sometimes you just get caught up in the moment and say things you would like to take back.
Just my pennies worth.
JeffreyNow, I want everyone to sing!
Love, Love, Love.
Love, Love, Love.
Love, Love, Love.
There s nothing you can do that can t be done.
Nothing you can sing that can t be sung.
Nothing you can say but you can learn how to play the game.It s easy.
Nothing you can make that can t be made.
No one you can save that can t be saved.
Nothing you can do but you can learn how to be you in time.
It s easy.
All you need is love.
All you need is love.
All you need is love, love.
Love is all you need.
All you need is love.
All you need is love.
All you need is love, love.
Love is all you need.
Nothing you can know that isn t known.
Nothing you can see that isn t shown.
Nowhere you can be that isn t where you re meant to be.
It s easy.
All you need is love.
All you need is love.
All you need is love, love.
Love is all you need.
All you need is love (All together, now!)
All you need is love. (Everybody!)
All you need is love, love.
Love is all you need (love is all you need).
Jeffrey
QuoteThere have been more than a few times that I have responded to a post, only to want to delete it. Sometimes you just get caught up in the moment and say things you would like to take back.
Unfortunately, Bill, the power to delete your post can also delete the " published" thoughts of other members that have posted after you. *That* is the problem, not whether or not you can delete your own words. The power to affect the posts of others should belong with the moderators of this forum, not the " rank and file" members. You can still delete the words of your own posts by simply using the " edit" function.
I m not trying to say anything bad to Bill, or about him. I respect his opinion and wouldn t want another member to be able to delete his posts without his permission. I m just pointing out how the software of this forum seems to operate. Until Admin can change the way the delete button works, we will continue to lose posts not intended to be lost.
Put it this way: A new member asks a question to which I give a totally bonehead (read: wrong) answer, and then another member gives the correct answer in reply to my post. In my embarrassment, I delete my post. Should the correct member have his/her post deleted as well?
Perhaps the " delete" button should be disabled until different code can be written allowing subsequent posts by other members to remain.
Ab Diver
QuoteORIGINAL: Ab Diver
Perhaps the " delete" button should be disabled until different code can be written allowing subsequent posts by other members to remain.
That is what I have done until I can talk to Steve. The ability to delete posts has been disabled in all " General" forums.
Ab Diver
QuotePut it this way: A new member asks a question to which I give a totally bonehead (read: wrong) answer, and then another member gives the correct answer in reply to my post. In my embarrassment, I delete my post. Should the correct member have his/her post deleted as well?
Dave,
I ve not noticed this. The times I have deleted a post, ONLY mine was deleted, no one elses. True, it does make the entire thread seem to not make sense, but that is better than a war one the board. IMO.
Now everyone SING!!!!
moderator1
QuoteThat is what I have done until I can talk to Steve. The ability to delete posts has been disabled in all " General" forums.
No offense, but bad idea..................................................................................
bikolee
QuoteORIGINAL: bikolee
I ve not noticed this. The times I have deleted a post, ONLY mine was deleted, no one elses. True, it does make the entire thread seem to not make sense, but that is better than a war one the board. IMO.
Bill, it all depends on how the other people posted their reply. If they clicked on teh big button on the top or bottom, their post would not go away, but if they clicked on the small reply buttin inside a post theirs goes away if the post they replyed to is deleted.
JeffreyI like to be able to delete also, used it on the old board a few times.
But, It is true... if you look at this page many of the posts happen to be replys to my post.
If I delete the one at the top they will all go. Don t make me show you!
And if someone is replying to one of the ones that go with it, theirs will also go.
It really needs to be shut off somehow, if that alone can t be shut off. Then just turn off the delete feature, and we can just edit them. By just leaving it blank or a face or something.
And I won t sing that sappy song[: (]
JeffreyThe whole chain-deletion thing was something I was unaware of prior to deleting my three posts on this subject. I often times delete my posts when I reflect upon them after a day. I don t apologize for deleting my posts, but I do apologize if it ended up deleting somebody else s. I guess now we all now know how to reply without having our posts inadvertently deleted by somebody else.
SactoCampersI knew it was you all along [8D][8D][8D]
Jeffrey
QuoteI like to be able to delete also, used it on the old board a few times.
But, It is true... if you look at this page many of the posts happen to be replys to my post.
Actually, Jeffery, my above post was in reply to the current subject of the thread started by Bearbait, and not to your specific post. (no offense [;)] )
I clicked on the main " post reply" button at the bottom of the page. But since your post is the first one at the start of this new page, my reply reads as a " direct reply to Jeffery" In other words, you have the power to delete a post that was not a direct reply to you. (or you would if Mod-1 hadn t disabled that function)
Gets kinda complicated, don t it?[&:]
Ab Diver
If you all don t sing, well, you know who will come get you...........
Seriously. We have seen this time and time again. The board gets slow, people get anxious, camping weather comes back around and things get back to " normal"
Ab DiverDid I say I am buying a tent ?
birol
QuoteORIGINAL: birol
Did I say I am buying a tent ?
Are you REALLY? OH, Birol, I am so happy for you!! Like Jeffrey said, it is a great in-between step ( and you WONT get kicked out as I am sure you know!)
[:)][:)][:)][:D][:D][8D][8D] And then you can make the board a busier place by posting your adventures in a tent and maybe asking for tent advice.. And that will please all of us!
Ab Diver
QuoteActually, Jeffery, my above post was in reply to the current subject of the thread started by Bearbait, and not to your specific post. (no offense )
Well you say that you weren t responding to me, but it says you were.[;)]
I see the delete button is gone, so your right!
JeffreyReply to Jeffery
NightOwlReply to Nightowl
Ab DiverGeneral Reply
Strange, The big button at the bottom or top of the screen made my reply to AB DIVER, instead of bearbait .........
Ab DiverOK folks! ENOUGH! I may have paid, but that doesn t mean I have to participate.........
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Ab DiverBikolee,
I fail to understand what you are upset at ?
Ab DiverBirol,
I m a bit upset/ashamed at the whole board for some of the things that have been shared....
Ab DiverI thought it was directed at me ......
We all need to cool off little bit and start seeing the positive things in life and at the board .......
Ab DiverWell, I can t get anyone to sing with me.......
Ab DiverLALALALALA LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLO
You are going to get us banned !!! The Banned Band members, Birol and Bikolee !!!
Jeffrey
QuoteAnd I won t sing that sappy song
Jeffrey,
I love you man, but I suggest you READ those lyrics again.
birol
QuoteLALALALALA LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLO
You are going to get us banned !!! The Banned Band members, Birol and Bikolee !!!
THANK YOU!!!! I hope you get your camper and a job soon. And if they ban us for being a band, then I guess we were just ment to be banned....
Ab DiverHey, you know, I ve been told I have a very good karaoke voice, now if we could set that song to a Hank Williams song.....[;)]
" I m not worried about my deleted post,
" All I care about is...
I will let you all finish it.....[8D]
Ab Diver[:D]
Ab DiverVarious threads are subjected to other people chiming in with sometimes off topic posts.
I have never realized that this was so disturbing for some of us. For those I offended, I apologize.
I also apologize for not realizing that we need to have a military discipline and stritcly reply to the thread subject.
Maybe some of us also want a line drawn in the sand that we are here to share ideas and have some fun while doing it and we don t want to be insulted.
" these people" " ruining it for everyone"
I feel so insulted here bearbait. I think you need to lighten up little bit.
If this is the way the board is going to go, I don t think I want to be a part of it [>:]
moderator1
QuoteORIGINAL: moderator1
This is why we have the free trial period, but is there more we can do?
These are the things we are looking for.
What about making the trial period a little longer - 10 days especially now in the winter doesn t seem like enough to get a good feel of this site? I know I lurked for at least 3 weeks before signing up and that was last summer when the site was free.
Or maybe getting some dealers to add a coupon for a free month with purchase of a new popup? Presented like that might get more attention. I know once I got here I was hooked [:D]
Or just have coupons with a special code at the dealers so that when people come into browse they can pick one up?
I am sure there are more ways.
bearbaitWow, I don t know but I m not buying this one. [;)]
Jeffrey[;)]
Jeffrey[:D]
Jeffrey
Jeffrey[:D]
JeffreyIs this the correct thread for favorite jellybean flavors?
JeffreyThe jellybeans are on this side of the line in the sand. Don t cross that line in the sand.................
Oh, and I almost forgot......" that s wonderful Bearbait"
JeffreyAnd of course gamecock camper shows up to chime in yet another thread with more fluff and personal attacks........why am I not suprised?
JeffreyI m the guy that started " Nantucket" ,
Got dumped like an old wooden bucket,
Now here s frownin Bearbait,
Whose game seems like love/hate,
Try a smile, when they jab... just duck it.
JeffreySaid a man high up on a plain,
Why do some people always complain?
Is life really that bad,
that they have to go mad?
Just ignore them or you might go insane.
JeffreyWhat have I done? [&:]
TrlrboyOh no, not another limerick thread [8D][8D][8D]
JeffreyNothing Trlrboy except revive the limerick thing, which I really enjoyed. We lost too many of those great limericks when someone deleted them anyway. Maybe you could start the limerick thread again on a separate subject.
Jeffrey
I once knew some poets of merit
Who used lighthearted words
As a carrot.
They high-jacked some threads
By using their heads
And hoped all their readers
Could " bearit"
JeffreyOkay, now this makes a lot of sense, to post replies to other people and then go and delete them so the whole thread is a bunch of nothing. It s like being on Jerry Seinfeld show, all about nothing. And it would be just about as funny (not) too, if it weren t for the folks who have enough sense to try to get rid of the grouchiness.
T
[;)]
JeffreyThere once was a bucket of dead fish
and it had a bad smell, not delish,
please empty the bucket
before we upchuck it
and make a big mess, oh ish!!
JeffreyHere s to a thread that got stolen
Tho its readership seems to be swollen,
We d all prefer laughter
And following after,
The sound of our popups a-rollin
OK gang, lets end this and admit that even though his style might be somewhat abrupt, BB did bring up some good points for all of us to ponder about the future of this board (but I said that before on this thread and NO ONE noticed) and like the poem says, let s laugh and go camping (and if there are other limericks, Birol is just a dieing for us to take our " art" ? to his new thread [;)])
bearbaitTo put this thread back on track, who really cares how many members there really are?
Oh, I guess Bearbait does....... What does it matter? I thought we were here to talk about, and give advice about pop-up camping. And to have some fun.
And bb, I did not hijack this thread with the sing song post. I was trying to calm everyone down. Didn t work....[:(]
Now if the 2 inches of ice would just go away.......
JeffreyI can not take one more of this kind of exchange of words.
I was also trying to lighten up the thread .... Misunderstood , or not understood.
I don t want to alineate anybody or upset anybody ...
Can we get on with the The Tent and the Limerick and other threads please ????
JeffreyI just want to express my disappointment in the way some members responded to this post. While you may not have agreed with Bearbait, he does have the right to ask critical questions. It is only through open and honest communication as well as looking at ourselves in the eyes of an outsider that we will be able to improve the board and make it more inviting to new members.
The comment was made that this was just like high school, and I have to agree. When things were said that some did not like they just began talking about anything other than the subject at hand, trying to drown out other peoples opinions.
IMHO this is a very sad day for this board