PopUp Times

My wife and I are looking at getting a pop-up.  We were looking at the hybrids, but to get the space that we would like, it would be a bit too much for our tow vehicle.  So we are back to our original idea, the good old pop-up.  We are towing with a Jeep Liberty with a 3.7 V-6 and a 5000 lb towing capacity.  So, it looks like we can handle most any of the pop-ups out there.

We will have our 70 lb. mutt, a 7 year old and a 2 year old.  We are interested in the pop ups that have a good amount of floor space, want to make sure that we have enough play room in case we get rained in.  We like the slide out models, but they tend to have a fairly low cargo capacity, I would think this would make us carry everything in the Jeep, right?  With the 26 gallons of water they carry, that's about 220 pounds, and some of these have little over that for cargo.  We need to have a toilet, but after reading a little, seems like a portable potty would be more versitile and easier to dump.  We don't really need a shower in it, but an outdoor shower would be nice to hose down the kids if they get muddy.  We probably won't be camping when it's real cold, but the furnace might be nice to crack the chilly mornings.  I don't know about the air conditioner, is it better to get that installed, or can I install it at some later date if I find I need it?

I've also seen several people mention the dealer's service.  Pop-ups seem to be pretty solid and I wouldn't think there would be all that much that can go bad on them.  What kinds of problems could I run into with these?

Also, is there a listing of the types of stuff a new pop up owner definately has to have before camping for the first time?

Thanks in advance

F_M

Welcome!

You'll find lots of opinions and support here.  Most everyone loves their own PU, so a lot of what you decide on depends on your needs.  

You didn't say where you live -- telling us that might give you some info. on dealers in your area.  The way I decided on what I wanted was to attend a large show with lots of different PUs in one place.  That way I could go back & forth between the trailers and compare features.  

One other thing you might want to do is go to a dealer, find someone who's waiting for their trailer, and ask them how they feel about the service department.  Usually someone who's got their trailer in for service will be honest.  :)  

Something I've heard others say that's a good idea is to get everything you want in your trailer -- don't settle for less because most of the time you'll regret it.  I hunted & hunted until I found the right sized trailer with the toilet/shower combo and weight and ... everything that made me happy.

Enjoy the search -- that will make the find that much more enjoyable!

Laura

Quote from: fritz_monroeMy wife and I are looking at getting a pop-up.  

I don't know about the air conditioner, is it better to get that installed, or can I install it at some later date if I find I need it?

Thanks in advance

F_M

Air Conditioners are a breeze to install later.  All it takes is a little ingenuity

 Check this one out :p


 

We are located in Baltimore, MD.  Several dealers in the area, and the RV show coming up in a couple weeks.  We have been looking at RVs for about 10 years, but only serious about buying this year.  I lean towards the mindset of getting everything that we want, but my wife is more along the lines of getting what we know we need.  She's the one that asked me if I thought we needed air conditioning, I just assumed that we'd get it.  She did insist that we not look at anything that doesn't have a furnace.

Speaking of a furnace, I understand they run propane and electric.  I saw people talking about the need for an extra battery, should I get one?  Is there a link that I can get more information about the batteries?

F_M

Quote from: fritz_monroe. Speaking of a furnace, I understand they run propane and electric.  I saw people talking about the need for an extra battery, should I get one?  Is there a link that I can get more information about the batteries?
F_M

You can use your battery to run your furnace for short periods.  They will drain the battery quite fast if left on for extended periods of time.  I have people putting it on the lowest setting at nightt and getting a couple nites out of the battery.  Some use a dual battery set-up for weekend dry camping.

Quote from: fritz_monroeWith the 26 gallons of water they carry, that's about 220 pounds, and some of these have little over that for cargo.  We probably won't be camping when it's real cold, but the furnace might be nice to crack the chilly mornings.  I don't know about the air conditioner, is it better to get that installed, or can I install it at some later date if I find I need it? F_M

[/COLOR]I would recomend filling up your fresh water tank at the park.  No need to carry the extra weight and extra wear and tear on the traler.  The more lbs. the lower you mpg's.

Quote from: Fuzzymike[/COLOR]I would recomend filling up your fresh water tank at the park.  No need to carry the extra weight and extra wear and tear on the traler.  The more lbs. the lower you mpg's.

Speaking of this, do most people load the trailer up with their clothes, food, coolers, etc for the trip?  Why I'm asking is I'm working on getting the back of the Jeep set up for the dog.  Maybe a platform that allows her to stay back there and still have a little room for some stuff.

Any laws about popping the tent up at rest areas to get at needed supplies?  And a transmission cooler, is this a do it yourself thing or best left to a pro?

F_M

Quote from: fritz_monroeIs there a link that I can get more information about the batteries?
 
 F_M

This is one of the best 12v links out there http://bart.ccis.com/home/mnemeth/12volt/12volt.htm
 Getting a 2nd battery would depend on what type of camping you plan on. Dry camping for 2 nights, a 2nd battery isn't really necessary unless you are running the furnace and have no other means of recharging. They are handy to have on longer trips if you have no generator or solar to recharge.

Quote from: ForestCreatureThis is one of the best 12v links out there http://bart.ccis.com/home/mnemeth/12volt/12volt.htm
 Getting a 2nd battery would depend on what type of camping you plan on. Dry camping for 2 nights, a 2nd battery isn't really necessary unless you are running the furnace and have no other means of recharging. They are handy to have on longer trips if you have no generator or solar to recharge.

I couldn't get to that link.  Fails for me.  Anyone able to get there?

F_M

Quote from: fritz_monroeI couldn't get to that link.  Fails for me.  Anyone able to get there?
 
 F_M

It works for me, try a copy and paste into the address bar if this one dosen't work
 
 http://bart.ccis.com/home/mnemeth/12volt/12volt.htm

Quote from: fritz_monroeSpeaking of this, do most people load the trailer up with their clothes, food, coolers, etc for the trip?  Why I'm asking is I'm working on getting the back of the Jeep set up for the dog.  Maybe a platform that allows her to stay back there and still have a little room for some stuff.

Any laws about popping the tent up at rest areas to get at needed supplies?  And a transmission cooler, is this a do it yourself thing or best left to a pro?

F_M

With your vehicle, it would probably be best to carry as much as you can in the vehicle. I've never heard of or can't imagine any laws against popping up in a rest area. I just think that would grow old real quick.

You don't have to mount your 2nd battery (if you choose to get one). You can get very nice plastic carrying cases for them at Walmart for under $10. Just make sure that you put it somewhere where it won't tip over or become a projectile in an accident. The back seat floor seems to work well.

Transmission coolers are relatively easy to install (depending on mechanical ability). Just make sure that you have room to put it in front of your radiator. There are lots of websites with handy tips. As I look at them, most make it seem more complicated then it really is. Of course, every vehicle is different.
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=installing+transmission+cooler&btnG=Google+Search

One thing that I always suggest when installing a trans cooler is to change your trans fluid and filter after the installation (if you have more than 25K miles on your vehicle). I don't know the year of your Jeep. It probably has a Mopar transmission. If it does, I highly recommend using ATF4 type trans fluid. If it is a pre 1999, you should have them drain out ALL of the old fluid (this sometimes takes three drains or a flush) and install all new ATF4. If it is a 1999 or newer you may already have ATF4. In that case, you could just get away with topping up the trans fluid if you have less than 50K. However, get the fluid & filter changed at 50K.

ATF4 is a synthetic fluid. It is supposedly good for the life of the vehicle. I don't buy that, especially when towing. It has far superior cooling properties than oil based fluids but it still gets contaminated.

For people that can't use the synthetic trans fluid (which I highly recommend), make sure that you change your fluid every 25K, especially if you do any towing.

Quote from: waveryWith your vehicle, it would probably be best to carry as much as you can in the vehicle.

I don't know the year of your Jeep. It probably has a Mopar transmission. If it does, I highly recommend using ATF4 type trans fluid.However, get the fluid & filter changed at 50K.

Why do you recommend most stuff in my TV?

It's a 2005 Jeep Liberty with 6,000 miles.  I do know it's synthetic fluid.

F_M

Welcome to the PU world. There is some great advise here about batteries, dry camping and such. I just wanted to add that you can also go to a campground that has hook ups. I live in the Northeast (Massachusetts) I usually camp in NH or Maine. We traditionally try to avoid full hookups, that would include a sewer hookup and sometimes cable or whatever else is available at that campground. I avoid these because you can end up camping around seasonals or the large RVs, not that I have anything against them. I prefer to camp around people with similar equipment. But I know of some campgrounds that have some nice water & electric sites that are wooded and have activities for the kids as well as a pool and other activities.
 My thoughts on air conditioning from a person living in the Northeast is that it is not needed. Again that is because of where I live. My DW might not agree with me, but there are not that many days in this area that I can see the need for it. You might have a couple of weeks in July maybe August but that's about it. A good fan can help. You might get a little more heat than I do. But you can judge that for yourself.
Good luck.

Quote from: fritz_monroeWhy do you recommend most stuff in my TV?

It's a 2005 Jeep Liberty with 6,000 miles.  I do know it's synthetic fluid.

F_M

Mainly, just to stay within the weight limits of the trailer. I seem to hear a certain amount of stories about bent axles and uneven tire wear on these trailers. They are very lightly built and the tolerances appear to be very close.

Having said that, I put most of the weight in my PU because I tow with a 2000 Chrysler Concord. It actually handles the (2700#) trailer extremely well but I don't want to overwhelm the rear weight on the car and have issues with bottoming out. I haven't yet and don't want to.

In your case, you should be able to handle more weight in the vehicle then in the trailer. Just an opinion :D .

Quote from: HargusI live in the Northeast
 My thoughts on air conditioning from a person living in the Northeast is that it is not needed. Again that is because of where I live. My DW might not agree with me, but there are not that many days in this area that I can see the need for it. You might have a couple of weeks in July maybe August but that's about it. A good fan can help. You might get a little more heat than I do. But you can judge that for yourself.
 Good luck.

I was the one who did not want the AC in the camper. DH won that one, he wanted it, we got the AC. My thought was that most of our camping is in Northern MI, the real hot days aren't that many.
 
 Now my thoughts are, I'm glad we have the AC. It's been used on quite a few out of state trips, and some hot weekends here in MI. If you plan on traveling south or out west the AC is VERY nice to have. It made a big difference for a good nights sleep when we camped in hot/muggy TN,PA and a hot week in Hocking Hills OH. Plus it adds to resale value and can make selling easier when you are ready to move up.

Quote from: fritz_monroeWhy do you recommend most stuff in my TV?

It's a 2005 Jeep Liberty with 6,000 miles.  I do know it's synthetic fluid.

F_M

In your case, I would recommend that you have the Jeep dealer install the trans cooler (if you need one at all). I wouldn't want to risk your warranty by giving them an excuse to deny an engine, cooling system or transmission claim. :(

Don't get me wrong, the dealer is not "Out to get you". Having been a Service Manager for a large Los Angeles Chevy dealership, I know how it works. If you have a transmission or any related problem, the technician is required to make a note of any aftermarket or customer installed item on the vehicle (like customer installed trans cooler) that could, in any way, be related to the item that he is working on. The warranty clerk then transfers that note to the factory claim.

If the dealership or factory rep has a higher than average warranty claim dollar amount, this will surely trigger a warranty audit. NO Service Manager wants a warranty audit because they are a major disruption in his business not to mention, his life. Therefore, they are quick to deny any warranty claim that could possibly be caused by "Customer neglect", in an effort to keep his warranty $ amount in line.

My thoughts on the AC (and I live just a wee bit south of you ---DH is actually from Baltimore) is...we wouldn't want to be without it in this area!  It has greatly improved summer camping anywhere near our hot, humid, summers...not to mention, its good "white noise" for sleeping.   DH had a hard time getting me to give up my tent...but once he started talking about how much more we could comfortably go camping, I changed my mind.  ;)

Quote from: waveryMainly, just to stay within the weight limits of the trailer. I seem to hear a certain amount of stories about bent axles and uneven tire wear on these trailers. They are very lightly built and the tolerances appear to be very close.

This brings up a whole new issue.  Weight ratings of trailers.  For instance, we are looking at the Jayco 1207.  This says that the weights are as follows:


Unloaded vehicle weight (lbs.)     1870
Approx. hitch weight (lbs.)           185
Gross vehicle weight rating (lbs.)  2950
Cargo carrying capacity              1080

To me, this means that the trailer itself weighs 1870#.  It also means that I could put an additional 1080# into this trailer.  This would include 23 gallons of water weighing in at 191#.  a propane tanks at 20#?  This would allow for about 800# of additional stuff, right?  The Jeep is rated at 5000#, and subtract from that the weight of the trailer at max, 2950#, leaves us an additional 2050#.  My entire family does not weigh this much.

Am I missing something here?  I just don't get the figures.

F_M

Quote from: fritz_monroeThis brings up a whole new issue.  Weight ratings of trailers.  For instance, we are looking at the Jayco 1207.  This says that the weights are as follows:


Unloaded vehicle weight (lbs.)     1870
Approx. hitch weight (lbs.)           185
Gross vehicle weight rating (lbs.)  2950
Cargo carrying capacity              1080

To me, this means that the trailer itself weighs 1870#.  It also means that I could put an additional 1080# into this trailer.  This would include 23 gallons of water weighing in at 191#.  a propane tanks at 20#?  This would allow for about 800# of additional stuff, right?  The Jeep is rated at 5000#, and subtract from that the weight of the trailer at max, 2950#, leaves us an additional 2050#.  My entire family does not weigh this much.

Am I missing something here?  I just don't get the figures.

F_M

Your figures are correct but you would be amazed at how fast that 1080# gets consumed. I would be a little leery about towing long distances close to the max anyway.

I have a feeling that most bent axles on trailers are due more to "Shock loading" from rough roads than from the actual standing weight of the trailer. Bottoming out the trailer due to max weight on a rough or bouncy road would be like dropping 5 tons of bricks on the trailer. Shock loading can easily be 10 times the standing weight. Just like hitting a nail with a hammer as apposed to the standing weight of the same hammer.

The problem comes in when you cannot tell that your trailer is bottoming out (and you can't). You can always tell when the TV bottoms out and it is much less likely to happen.

Quote from: waveryYour figures are correct but you would be amazed at how fast that 1080# gets consumed. I would be a little leery about towing long distances close to the max anyway.

Won't surprise me at all.  I know from backpacking how fast weight adds up.  I definately would not tow close to max.  I wanted to make sure that I'm not missing something.  I used to think that that weight was in addition to anything that was in the TV.  Of course looking back, that really wouldn't make sense.

I was first looking at the hybrids.  My DW was concerned about wildlife, but I reminded her about camping in the tent with black bears in the area, and she calmed down a bit.  We found that to get the floor space we were looking for, we'd have to get a trailer that wouldn't be easily towed.  So we went back to our original idea of a pop up.  

F_M

Quote from: fritz_monroeThis brings up a whole new issue.  Weight ratings of trailers.  For instance, we are looking at the Jayco 1207.  This says that the weights are as follows:
 
 
 Unloaded vehicle weight (lbs.)     1870
 Approx. hitch weight (lbs.)           185
 Gross vehicle weight rating (lbs.)  2950
 Cargo carrying capacity              1080
 

 Am I missing something here?  I just don't get the figures.
 
 F_M

Don't forget that the "unloaded weight" does not include any options you choose that are not standard to the model, fridge, furnace, AC etc.
 
 Our Aliner weight is around 1200 without options, by the time all our options were installed it tops out at 1850.
 

I'm less concerned about the heavier items than the bulky items, like sleeping bags.  Do you use sleeping bags in a PUP?  Cooler and food can go in the TV, but I want to make sure there's room in there for the family.  ;)

We actually tend to pack fairly light.  My view of packing is if we forget something, we obviously don't really need it.  If it was really important, we wouldn't forget it.

BTW, Another that we are looking at is the Fleetwood Highlander (http://www.fleetwoodrv.com/highlander/default.aspx) So you can see we are looking at the larger units.

You'll be twords the top end capacity of the Jeep by the time all is packed , the biggest downfall I see is is the 6cyl. It'll huff and puff all the way up decent sized hills.
 
 We use sheets and blankets, sleeping bags when I'm either to lazy or don't have time to make the bed up before we go (a luxury of not having a bunk end, the beds not limited by the roof closing onto the bed)
 
 You asked about lists of must haves, if you're a tent camper you probably have the main necessities for camping. Tim5055 has a good list, here's the link...hope this one works for you :)
 http://www.title-3.com/Camping_Checklist.htm
 

I don't know what kind of dog you have, but I've got a 70# Lab, and she shares the back end of my Explorer with a cooler and Rubbermaid container when we travel.  She's got her pad back there & seems to have plenty of room to sleep.  That being said, my cooler isn't huge, and the Rubbermaid isn't that big either.  

Play around with how to pack things.  It took me 2-3 trips to figure what worked for me.  Bedding (blankets & 1 sleeping bag) stay in the trailer all the time.  If the sheets have been slept on less than 5 times by the same person, they stay on the beds.  Otherwise they go into a laundry bag, get washed, and then put back into the bag & thrown inside the door of the trailer.  Same thing with towels.  They'll fit into smaller spaces & are lightweight if that's a worry.  Clothes in a duffel work for me, and I've heard several people say that each family member has their own & they get stored on the bunk ends when the trailer is popped up.  Those, too, can be thrown inside the door for travel.

Have fun picking out your trailer!

HI,, good thread,, good board.   I am in almost the exact same situation.. same TV  05' jeep liberty v-6..   I'm EXTREMELY nervous about towing with this vehicle.  We plan on equipping the trailer that we are purchasing with a weight distribution hitch and sway bars.  The trailer is a Fleetwood Bayside and I am obsessing over the weight.. anyone have any thoughts on this TV-PUP combo?
THANKS FOR LOOKING!!

As For the popping up to get supplies. We learned very early if we needed it on the road it got packed in something portable and got left in the doorway or within reach inside the camper. No need to raise the roof more than an inch to open the door.

I think you'll be fine placing most of your stuff in the trailer, just keep an eye on the weight. If you put too much in the back of that Jeep you'll wind up with a whole different problem, and I doubt the Liberty is any stronger than the JGC is in that dept. I really beilieve if you have your 'stuff' well balanced throughout the trailer and the Jeep, keeping the weight down the best you can and making sure you have about 15% more weight to the front of the trailer you'll be good to go!

Remember, Jeeps have a great tow rating...read that as pulling power! They don't have so great rear springs in them! Kind of curious what the GCVW rating is for the Liberty (this is the combined weight rating for both the Jeep and whatever it's towing and all it's cargo etc?)...

Great thread!

I love the Niagara - that's my vote for your family, heehee. We're currently looking at a 2000 Fleetwood Coleman :rolleyes: Timberlake.  Going to look at it tomorrow. And we are totally green around the ears as well!  Great answers and looking forward to viewing YOUR thread more :p

Quote from: PITPOP27I love the Niagara - that's my vote for your family, heehee. We're currently looking at a 2000 Fleetwood Coleman :rolleyes: Timberlake.  Going to look at it tomorrow. And we are totally green around the ears as well!  Great answers and looking forward to viewing YOUR thread more :p

The Niagara is the one we are leaning towards also.  We like the floor plan and the DW likes the walls around the potty.  We are swinging by a local dealer to take a look at some Jaycos and Fleetwoods.  Another thing that we like about the Niagara it comes standard with the furnace, fridge, toilet, stereo and microwave.  Although I don't really see myself using a microwave while camping, you never know. ;)

The dealer has a 2005 Fleetwood Newport.  It appears to be pretty close to the 2006 Fleetwood Sequoia.  Anyone know anything about the Newport?

Quote from: fritz_monroeThe Niagara is the one we are leaning towards also.  We like the floor plan and the DW likes the walls around the potty.  We are swinging by a local dealer to take a look at some Jaycos and Fleetwoods.  Another thing that we like about the Niagara it comes standard with the furnace, fridge, toilet, stereo and microwave.  Although I don't really see myself using a microwave while camping, you never know. ;)

The dealer has a 2005 Fleetwood Newport.  It appears to be pretty close to the 2006 Fleetwood Sequoia.  Anyone know anything about the Newport?

We didn't think that we would use the microwave either. We end up using it a lot.

Ever try cooking bacon in the microwave?? Yum :D

Great for baked potatoes and just heating coffee water.

You can run them off of a 1500w inverter too. You just run it for a few minutes so it's not a big battery drain. Great for early morning when you don't want to disturb the neighbors with the generator while dry camping ;) .

Quote from: fritz_monroeThe dealer has a 2005 Fleetwood Newport. It appears to be pretty close to the 2006 Fleetwood Sequoia. Anyone know anything about the Newport?

My dealer in PA listed the Newport at $11,247 during the summer of 2005.  That included an awning.  There isn't a slide out on the trailer.  The floor plan starting at the rode side rear of the trailer is Shower, stove/oven, dinette.  The dinette does not block access to the bed.  It sits along the wall not across the end of the trailer.  On the curb side of the trailer starting at the rear of the PU there is a hutch with the refrigerator, a small section of counter with the microwave under it and the sink.  In the 2005 brochure it shows only a single bowl sink, not the double bowl the other Highlanders have.  Next is the door way and then a counter with storage under it.  There is a step at each end to help you get into the bunkend.:)

Quote from: fritz_monroeSpeaking of this, do most people load the trailer up with their clothes, food, coolers, etc for the trip?  Why I'm asking is I'm working on getting the back of the Jeep set up for the dog.  Maybe a platform that allows her to stay back there and still have a little room for some stuff.

Any laws about popping the tent up at rest areas to get at needed supplies?  And a transmission cooler, is this a do it yourself thing or best left to a pro?

F_M

As long as you don't need to get to far inside the PU you can crank it up 3-4 inches so you can open the door and put some items in.  Too much in the trailer can really change how it acts on the road.

I really appreciate all the input.  As for the Newport, I kind of like the floorplan, but not as much as the Niagara, but the several thousand dollars difference might be enough to sway our minds.  :p  

As I said about the Niagara, I really like that all those items that are options on other models are included on this one.  If I'm not mistaken, this means that the CCC rating will be mainly for water weight and personal camping "stuff."

We bought our first popup last year. While we didn't use the heater, it was one of our essential items. Be sure to fire it up and burn the new out of it and  then air out the pu before going camping.
 
 We got the a/c with ours. While it is not absolutely necessary, we use it all of the time. It sure makes those hot sticky nights we have in Arkansas a lot better.
 
 We didn't get a built in toilet or shower because we didn't want to lose the space. We plan on getting outside units this year.
 
 We also bought an add-a-room when we purchased the p/u. We use it every trip. It gives us more space to get out of the rain (which sure was handy because it rained at least part of every day every trip last year). It also gives us a place to remove and store our shoes outside of the p/u, which helps keep the p/u cleaner. We are planning on keeping a porta-potti in it at night to cut down on midnight potty runs.
 
 Two other items I consider essential are the BAL leveler and the BAL chock
 they make setup a lot simpler and make the camper a lot more stable.
 
 I don't fill my water tank before arriving at the campground. We carry all of our clothes and other items we don't want to get wet in the camper and everything else in the tow vehicle.

Well, just got back from the RV place.  They didn't have any PUPs set up, but we had them pull out the Newport we wanted to look at.  We like the set up, but had a tough time getting the top closed back up.  Is it normal to have to put all your weight on a corner of the roof to get it to latch?  It only needed to drop down about an eigth of an inch, but seemed tough to close.  It also has a lot of counter space, but the spigot is kind of low.

Sure looks long when it's folded up.  Anyone know if my Jeep Liberty will have any issues with this long trailer?  Since this is my first trailer purchase, I'm really concerned with the abilities of my TV.

I have to push down hard on ours too.

Quote from: fritz_monroeIs it normal to have to put all your weight on a corner of the roof to get it to latch? It only needed to drop down about an eigth of an inch, but seemed tough to close.

When it is cooler out the tenting is harder to compress.  The roof latches can be adjusted.  What I do is lenghen the latch and then close it.  Wait a few minutes and then shorten the latch.  Also I only hook all 4 latches and then close them after they are all hooked.  If I latch 3 of them the fourth one always seems to be a problem.  Is there just a single bowl sink?  What price are they asking?
 
What is the tow capacity of your TV?:)

Quote from: tlhdocWhen it is cooler out the tenting is harder to compress.  The roof latches can be adjusted.  What I do is lenghen the latch and then close it.  Wait a few minutes and then shorten the latch.  Also I only hook all 4 latches and then close them after they are all hooked.  If I latch 3 of them the fourth one always seems to be a problem.  Is there just a single bowl sink?  What price are they asking?
 
What is the tow capacity of your TV?:)

I believe the price was around 11,000, but not entirely sure.  It is new, though.  It is a single bowl sink and the spiggot is pretty low, about the height of the typical bathroom sink.