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Two questions
1) Does anyone know if there is a wiring harness or some other way to connect the Prodigy brake controller to a 1971 Ford F-100 truck?

2) Does anyone know if adding an after market, bolt on leaf to the rear springs would help handle the weight of the trailer in towing?
Thanks,
marc

Quote from: acharya108Two questions
1) Does anyone know if there is a wiring harness or some other way to connect the Prodigy brake controller to a 1971 Ford F-100 truck?

2) Does anyone know if adding an after market, bolt on leaf to the rear springs would help handle the weight of the trailer in towing?
Thanks,
marc

I'll leave your first question to the Prodigy users already on the board -


As for the rear springs, have you tried ~

http://www.mrtruck.net/springs.htm


Fly

Quote from: acharya108Two questions
1) Does anyone know if there is a wiring harness or some other way to connect the Prodigy brake controller to a 1971 Ford F-100 truck?

I'll bet you have to wire it manually.

Quote2) Does anyone know if adding an after market, bolt on leaf to the rear springs would help handle the weight of the trailer in towing?
Thanks,
marc

The best approach is to use a weight distributing hitch.  But if a 1971 F-100 can't handle the tongue weight of a pop-up, either there's way too much stuff in the pop-up or there's some serious problems with the truck.

Austin

Quote from: flyfishermanI'll leave your first question to the Prodigy users already on the board -


As for the rear springs, have you tried ~

http://www.mrtruck.net/springs.htm


Fly

Thanks Fly. I checked out the site. Impressive testimonials from customers!
I e-mailed them as my old 1971 Ford truck is not listed. But there should not be a problem as one of the models should fit.
marc

Quote from: acharya108Thanks Fly. I checked out the site. Impressive testimonials from customers!
I e-mailed them as my old 1971 Ford truck is not listed. But there should not be a problem as one of the models should fit.
marc

Don't worry, It's really easy to wire in yourself. All you need is about 4 Scotchlock wire splicers:
http://www.parts-express.com/webpage.cfm?webpage_id=3&CAT_ID=39&ObjectGroup_ID=403&raid=1&rak=scotchlok

Quote from: AustinBostonI'll bet you have to wire it manually.



The best approach is to use a weight distributing hitch.  But if a 1971 F-100 can't handle the tongue weight of a pop-up, either there's way too much stuff in the pop-up or there's some serious problems with the truck.

Austin

It's not really the weight, but the suspension on the truck is too soft. It tows the PUP just fine, but just needs to be stiffer. It's rated at a half ton, butthe bed rides too low when I was carrying some gravel. I thought that a stiffer suspension or an extra leaf would improve the handling and ride, by taking some of the bounce out.
marc

Quote from: waveryDon't worry, It's really easy to wire in yourself. All you need is about 4 Scotchlock wire splicers:
http://www.parts-express.com/webpage.cfm?webpage_id=3&CAT_ID=39&ObjectGroup_ID=403&raid=1&rak=scotchlok

Thanks, I have used those before.
marc

If you've got bounce, that's bad shocks, replace them with a good quality shock.
If you've got sag under the 150lbs(average) of camper tongue weight, then that's weak leaf springs and you could install either another one or two springs on each side, or a set of the helper springs.

I wouldn't use the weight of gravel in the bed as an idicator that it won't carry the tongue weight of a PUP.  2 different things!  Half a yard of gravel might weight 400-600lbs (just guessing).

Quote from: austinado16If you've got bounce, that's bad shocks, replace them with a good quality shock.
If you've got sag under the 150lbs(average) of camper tongue weight, then that's weak leaf springs and you could install either another one or two springs on each side, or a set of the helper springs.

I wouldn't use the weight of gravel in the bed as an idicator that it won't carry the tongue weight of a PUP.  2 different things!  Half a yard of gravel might weight 400-600lbs (just guessing).

I don't know what PU the poster (or you) has but the recommended tongue weight is 10-15% of the total trailer weight (on a PU).

My tongue weight is 360# and could easily go to 450#. My trailer weighs 3200#. Throw a bunch of camping gear in the back of the truck and I am easily at my limit of 950# (including my topper) on the rear axle.

It is perfectly reasonable to think that 35-year-old leaf springs may be weak. Helper springs are one solution. However, on a truck that old, you may want to consider a new set of springs for towing. A broken spring is no fun. It could require leaving your trailer on the side of the road while you take the pick-up to get it repaired. Not a pleasant thought.

Quote from: acharya108It's not really the weight, but the suspension on the truck is too soft. It tows the PUP just fine, but just needs to be stiffer. It's rated at a half ton, butthe bed rides too low when I was carrying some gravel. I thought that a stiffer suspension or an extra leaf would improve the handling and ride, by taking some of the bounce out.
marc

How much gravel?  I don't know of a true pop-up with a tongue weight over 400 lbs., most are in the 150-200 lb. range.

"Stiffer" means different things to different people.

If the back of the truck sags under the tongue weight, AND the original suspension is performing to specification, then the correct remedy is still a weight distributing hitch.

If the truck is bouncing up and down when loaded, that is a shock absorber issue, and new/stiffer shocks are the solution.  Nothe that I am not talking about air shocks here.

If the back of the truck sags under loads that it handled fine when new, then additional leaf springs (or possibly air bags if they are compatible with your truck) might be the answer.

Austin

Quote from: AustinBostonHow much gravel?  I don't know of a true pop-up with a tongue weight over 400 lbs., most are in the 150-200 lb. range.

"Stiffer" means different things to different people.

If the back of the truck sags under the tongue weight, AND the original suspension is performing to specification, then the correct remedy is still a weight distributing hitch.

If the truck is bouncing up and down when loaded, that is a shock absorber issue, and new/stiffer shocks are the solution.  Nothe that I am not talking about air shocks here.

If the back of the truck sags under loads that it handled fine when new, then additional leaf springs (or possibly air bags if they are compatible with your truck) might be the answer.

Austin

Actually, it handles the tongue weight and tows ok, but still has a "bouncing" over bumps. I was carrying a half ton of gravel about 1.000 lbs when I had the sag. I know that I probably need to replace the shocks, but thought that the leaf springs could use some extra support also.
marc

Quote from: acharya108Actually, it handles the tongue weight and tows ok, but still has a "bouncing" over bumps. I was carrying a half ton of gravel about 1.000 lbs when I had the sag. I know that I probably need to replace the shocks, but thought that the leaf springs could use some extra support also.
marc

I know that some here have a real issue with air-shocks. I have them on my truck and I love them. I checked out all of the attaching, mounting and supporting points on this truck. It is well suited for air-shocks. I put 200PSI in them while towing and the truck rides level. While not towing it rides too rough so I lower the pressure to 75PSI and it rides great.

I would think that your '71 F100 may well be well suited for them also. They will remedy the "Bouncy" problem and should help support the additional weight. Just be sure to check all of the attaching points for wear.
http://www.jcwhitney.com/autoparts/ProductBrowse/showCustom-0/makeName-Ford/makeId-29/modelName-F-Series%20Pickup/modelId-6691/year-1971/showAll-1/N-+200729571+1971/refId-20004492/Pr-p_Product.CATENTRY_ID:2006168/c-10101/p-2006168/tf-Browse/s-10101

New springs and shocks would be the best remedy. New shocks and air bags would be 2nd, new shocks and bolt-on helper leaf springs would be 3rd and air shocks would be 4th but least expensive (IMHO).

Quote from: waveryI know that some here have a real issue with air-shocks. I have them on my truck and I love them.

As long as you realize that on the 2000 S-10 (and probably the '99, but I'm not sure), that using air shocks voided the original warranty.  Aparently, Chevrolet had a problem with them, too.

I can't imagine a '71 having a problem unless it is badly worn or corroded, but both the wear and corrosion are a distinct possibility with a 36 year old truck.

Austin

Quote from: AustinBostonAs long as you realize that on the 2000 S-10 (and probably the '99, but I'm not sure), that using air shocks voided the original warranty.  Aparently, Chevrolet had a problem with them, too.

I can't imagine a '71 having a problem unless it is badly worn or corroded, but both the wear and corrosion are a distinct possibility with a 36 year old truck.

Austin

I was a Factory Rep for GM (many years ago, late 70s). I can tell you that ANY time that non-factory parts are used on a vehicle it will void the warranty, at least on anything that works in conjunction with that part.

If GM took issue with air shocks on that particular vehicle, it may well have had more to do with drive shaft alignment than suspension. That is why I let the pressure down to 75PSI when not loaded. If I don't, the back-end sticks up in the air and the double drive-shaft is inverted. My S10 has your typical "Truck" mountings for the rear shocks. Not a problem IMHO.

Thanks for your concern :sombraro: .

I'd expect some sag with 1,000lbs of gravel in the bed for sure. Sounds normal to me.  I'd throw a real nice set of shocks under it....do all 4, and see what you think.  You can spend up from there if need be, but I'll bet the shocks dial it in.

Wavery, I've still got the '87 Starcraft Nova.  11' box and maybe 22' opened.  Probobly about 1,300 and change empty and a tongue weight under 200lbs because I can pick the tongue up......so I'm guessing 140ish.

Quote from: waveryI was a Factory Rep for GM (many years ago, late 70s). I can tell you that ANY time that non-factory parts are used on a vehicle it will void the warranty, at least on anything that works in conjunction with that part.

If GM took issue with air shocks on that particular vehicle, it may well have had more to do with drive shaft alignment than suspension. That is why I let the pressure down to 75PSI when not loaded. If I don't, the back-end sticks up in the air and the double drive-shaft is inverted. My S10 has your typical "Truck" mountings for the rear shocks. Not a problem IMHO.

Thanks for your concern :sombraro: .

I hope you don't think every time I "correct" you that I'm even thinking of you.  I'm really thinking of the 90% of the people who read without posting.  For example, this makes post #16 for this thread, while the thread has been "read" over 170 times.

You have proven yourself both intelligent and knowledgeable (even if I don't always agree with you); it's the idiots I worry about, like the one who posted today about hauling a Coleman Sun Valley with with a 10-YO 4-banger (despite claiming to have an F-250, he tows with a small car).  The guy registered months ago, but has only posted 5 times.  He doesn't know that it's about the drive shaft alignment (or sometimes the ABS detection); he just knows "that GM factory-sumthin' guy does it, so it must be OK."  In his own words, "I have got a lot of useful info off of this site."

Austin

Quote from: AustinBostonI hope you don't think every time I "correct" you that I'm even thinking of you.  I'm really thinking of the 90% of the people who read without posting.  For example, this makes post #13 or 14, while the thread has been "read" over 170 times.

You have proven yourself both intelligent and knowledgeable (even if I don't always agree with you); it's the idiots I worry about, like the one who posted today about hauling a Coleman Sun Valley with with a 10-YO 4-banger.  The guy registered months ago, but has only posted 5 times.  He doesn't know that it's about the drive shaft alignment (or sometimes the ABS detection); he just knows "that GM factory sumthin' guy does it, so it must be OK."  In his own words, "I have got a lot of useful info off of this site."

Austin

I post for the very same reason. I also don't mind being corrected and admitting if I'm wrong. It's all part of the interchange of ideas and sharing those ideas and theories with many others.

That's also why I seldom get adamant or personal about things.

Often times people will PM me with questions. I usually ask them to post the question so that others may learn from the exchange and that also gives people the ability to correct me when I am wrong or give a better solution to the problem that I may not have considered.

I personally think that some of the "Long winded" discussions that we have had ("we" meaning the entire board), have benefited quite a few people. I know that I have benefited from them and find them stimulating :D .

Hi

A couple of questions

Does the truck bounce when it is loaded or not loaded.

What type of tires and pressure.

Most early pickups bounced when not loaded and road much smoother when weight was added. The suspension was designed under loaded and the ride when not loaded was not good.

joe

Quote from: waveryI post for the very same reason. I also don't mind being corrected and admitting if I'm wrong. It's all part of the interchange of ideas and sharing those ideas and theories with many others.

That's also why I seldom get adamant or personal about things.

Often times people will PM me with questions. I usually ask them to post the question so that others may learn from the exchange and that also gives people the ability to correct me when I am wrong or give a better solution to the problem that I may not have considered.

I personally think that some of the "Long winded" discussions that we have had ("we" meaning the entire board), have benefited quite a few people. I know that I have benefited from them and find them stimulating :D .

I apologize if my questions seem foolish or ill-informed, but as y6u all have said, this forum is a good learning forum for us new people. I am retired from 40 years in the emergency medical profession. New graduates were always a challenge, but if they showed interest and a desire to learn they were more readily accepted. We all have to start somewhere and there is always more to learn. I hope that i never run out of some new challenge, experience or opportunity to learn something new.
I thank all of you for the advice and help provided. I am sure that I will need more.
marc

Quote from: acharya108I apologize if my questions seem foolish or ill-informed, but as y6u all have said, this forum is a good learning forum for us new people. I am retired from 40 years in the emergency medical profession. New graduates were always a challenge, but if they showed interest and a desire to learn they were more readily accepted. We all have to start somewhere and there is always more to learn. I hope that i never run out of some new challenge, experience or opportunity to learn something new.
I thank all of you for the advice and help provided. I am sure that I will need more.
marc

Please....never be sorry for asking questions. We ALL learn things when people ask questions. Your question is read by many (as stated above) and many profit from it. :sombraro:

Quote from: joeHi......What type of tires and pressure.......joe

*clink*


Uh-oh.......I think somebody just stepped on landmine.

I'm gonna skoot over here------------------------------------->outa the way.

Quote from: joeHi

A couple of questions

Does the truck bounce when it is loaded or not loaded.

What type of tires and pressure.

Most early pickups bounced when not loaded and road much smoother when weight was added. The suspension was designed under loaded and the ride when not loaded was not good.

joe

It bounces both loaded and unloaded, but unloaded is definitely worse. It doesn't bounce excessively, as the present shocks do dampen a bit, but it seems that you are probably right when you state that the suspension was designed under loaded conditions.
  The tires are 15 inch with 35 to 42 psi pressure rating.
It definitely sags in the rear more than it should, or perhaps it's weight rating is over rated.
Due to the age, the springs might have some fatigue, but this truck was not used to carry a lot of weight by the previous owner. I am only the third owner and I know the previous owner. I have ordered new shocks from Gabriel and will see how it rides after I install them. I have another load of gravel that I need to get and that will tell the difference in the new shocks. It really tows the Coachmen Classic without problem, but has a little sway on the highway. Perhaps the weight distributing hitch vs anti-sway bar/ Super Spring etc. I'll wait until I see how the new shocks do before making any other changes.
marc

Quote from: acharya108. I'll wait until I see how the new shocks do before making any other changes.
marc

Wise decision. It's a good idea to make your changes one at a time so that you know which change made a difference.

While you are installing the shocks, it might be a good idea to make sure that all of your spring shackle bolts are tight and the bushings are in good shape. You shouldn't have and sway with that truck.

Is your trailer riding level when towing??? If the front is too high, that may cause swaying.

One other thought, make sure the tires are LT rated, and no P rated.  P=passenger car tire, LT=light truck.

When I first bought our Suburban it had a set of P rated tires and it was like driving on marshmallows because the sidewalls were so squishy.

Quote from: waveryWise decision. It's a good idea to make your changes one at a time so that you know which change made a difference.

While you are installing the shocks, it might be a good idea to make sure that all of your spring shackle bolts are tight and the bushings are in good shape. You shouldn't have and sway with that truck.

Is your trailer riding level when towing??? If the front is too high, that may cause swaying.

Thanks Waverly & Todd. I will check all fittings and connections as they can come loose with time and I will verify the tire ratings and actual pressure. I will re=post when I have results to share.
marc

Hi

The reason I was asking about the tires was that your truck was designed to have bais ply tires, not radials (which I assume you have), with presuures from 24 to 28 or 30 depending on the load. The 71 F100 came equip with G78 15 4 ply passenger type tires. These tire sride and behave a lot different then radials.

A way to check the shocks is to stand on the rear bumper and pump your knees to get the truck to bounce. Once the truck is bouncing step off and see how many bounces the truck does before it stops. One bounce is great 2 is good and anything more then two the shocks should be replaced.

When working on olding vehicles you need to take care and find out what the original conditions were. Most older vehicle do not act like newer ones. But more important things that are done to fix or modify newer vehicles might not work on older ones.

Below is a web site that is for 67 to 72 Ford pick ups. They can help you out better with your truck then this web site. Take a look, there is also a forum on the web site.

http://www.fordification.com/lit-home.htm


joe

Wow, what a nice site for the vintage Ford crowd!!

QuoteAs long as you realize that on the 2000 S-10 (and probably the '99, but I'm not sure), that using air shocks voided the original warranty. Aparently, Chevrolet had a problem with them, too.

I can't imagine a '71 having a problem unless it is badly worn or corroded, but both the wear and corrosion are a distinct possibility with a 36 year old truck.

Austin

FYI

I work in the automotive after market and run into this all the time. If the product was designed to be a DIRECT replacement for the vehicle it will not void the warranty. As far as the air shocks they are NOT a direct replacement.


Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, which states, in part, in Title 15, United States Code, Section 2302, subdivision (c), as follows:

Quote from: austinado16I wouldn't use the weight of gravel in the bed as an idicator that it won't carry the tongue weight of a PUP.  2 different things!  Half a yard of gravel might weight 400-600lbs (just guessing).

Gravel weighs MUCH more than that! It weighs in at 1.45 tons per yard, so a half yard of gravel would weigh about 1,450 lbs.!  :yikes: