Title: What size generator
Post by: eo19 on Nov 17, 2009, 08:46 PM
Post by: eo19 on Nov 17, 2009, 08:46 PM
What's the minimum watt generator I can get to use on my 2000 Coleman Utah? Heater, fridge, lights, fan. Might add on an A/C unit.
Title:
Post by: wavery on Nov 17, 2009, 09:01 PM
Post by: wavery on Nov 17, 2009, 09:01 PM
Quote from: eo19;212614What's the minimum watt generator I can get to use on my 2000 Coleman Utah? Heater, fridge, lights, fan. Might add on an A/C unit.
"Might add on an A/C unit" is the key.
The way you are now, I would recommend a Honda 1000 (running all your stuff and charging batteries) or 2000 (runs a microwave, coffee pot, electric heater and higher amp appliances). They are light weight, economical and quiet. The EU2000i can run some A/C units, just be careful what A/C unit that you buy (check the start-up wattage).
A/C puts you into a whole new category. You may need to determine how much weight you are willing to lift around the campsite, load & unload..... You can consider the Yamaha 2400 which is quiet but heavy, Honda 3000 which is quite and very heavy or 2-Honda 2000s, hooked in series to produce 4000W (expensive but back saving). This would give you the option of taking one generator on 90% of your camp-outs where the A/C isn't needed and having the option of taking both but you only have to carry 1 lite weight generator at a time.
Two Honda 2000s are about the same weight as a Yamaha 2400 but you only need to carry one 47# unit at a time instead of the 75# Yamaha 2400 or 100# Honda 3000.
There are also some cheaper "Clones" of these units on the market (made in China). I have no idea how dependable or reliable they are.
Title:
Post by: Hoagie on Nov 18, 2009, 12:06 PM
Post by: Hoagie on Nov 18, 2009, 12:06 PM
If you want to stick with one generator and you determine you need more than the the Honda 2000, Honda just came out with a new EU3000i Handi generator. It is designed to be more portable than the original E3000iS(which they are still selling) and is 56.4lbs less weight.
From the Camping World website...
EU3000iS
From the Camping World website...
EU3000iS
- 3000 watts max. (25 amps), 2800 watts rated (23.3 amps) 120-volt AC
- 12-volt DC output 144 watts (12 amps)
- Dimensions 25.8"L x 18.9"W x 22.4"H
- Weighs 134 lbs.
- 196cc Honda GX200 single cylinder OHC air cooled engine
- 20 hrs. run time at 1/4 load, 7.2 hrs. at rated load
- Tank capacity 3.4 gallons
- 49 dB at 1/4 load, 58 dB at rated load
- Recoil start
- Wheel kit for Honda 3000 Generator available separately.
- Only available at retail SuperCenters
- NEW FEATURE! Honda?s lightest, most portable 3000 watt generator
- NEW FEATURE! Built-in wheels, tow handle and fixed offset lift handles
- 3000 watts max. (25 amps), 2600 watts rated (21.7 amps) 120-volt AC
- 12-volt DC output 100 watts (8.3 amps)
- NEW SMALLER SIZE! Dimensions 24.5?L x 14.875?W x 19.5?H
- Weighs 77.6 lbs.
- 163cc Honda GX160 single cylinder OHC air cooled engine
- 7.7 hrs. run time at 1/4 load, 3.6 hrs. at rated load
- Tank capacity 1.56 gallons
- 57 dB at 1/4 load, 65 dB at rated load
- Works in parallel with another EU3000i Handi? portable generator models only (cables #25929)
- Recoil start
Title:
Post by: wavery on Nov 18, 2009, 12:26 PM
Post by: wavery on Nov 18, 2009, 12:26 PM
That is a cool looking genset
http://www.hondapowerequipment.com/products/modeldetail.aspx?page=modeldetail§ion=P2GG&modelname=EU3000iHandi&modelid=EU3000iHAN
but @ $2200 :yikes: I think that I would opt for 2 of the EU2000ia's @ $1100 each. Easier to handle and you get 4000w when you need it.......what is Honda thinking about??
I guess they need a unit that competes with Yamaha's 2400w unit @ $1200
http://salestores.com/yamaha04.html
$2200 :yikes: That's far from a competitive price IMHO and the Yamaha is quieter.
http://www.hondapowerequipment.com/products/modeldetail.aspx?page=modeldetail§ion=P2GG&modelname=EU2000i&modelid=EU2000IAN
You can pick up good used Honda EU2000i's on craigslist for $750 each. That's what I did and mine were/are like new. I have hundreds of hours on mine. I bought a Yamaha 2400 for my son for $800 (craigslist) and it had less than 10 hours on it.
The other thing that should be kept in mind is that any generator that you get will spend most of it's running time @ low amp draw. The fuel consumption on a single Honda 2000w genset is (@ low draw) is about 1/2 of the bigger units. I typically get 10-12 hours off of a gallon of gas (it is rated @ 15 hrs per 1.1G). The Honda 3000Handi and the Yamaha2400 are both rated @ 5 hrs per gal (low draw). That's double the fuel consumption of a single Honda 2000 @ the same low draw amps.
http://www.hondapowerequipment.com/products/modeldetail.aspx?page=modeldetail§ion=P2GG&modelname=EU3000iHandi&modelid=EU3000iHAN
but @ $2200 :yikes: I think that I would opt for 2 of the EU2000ia's @ $1100 each. Easier to handle and you get 4000w when you need it.......what is Honda thinking about??
I guess they need a unit that competes with Yamaha's 2400w unit @ $1200
http://salestores.com/yamaha04.html
$2200 :yikes: That's far from a competitive price IMHO and the Yamaha is quieter.
http://www.hondapowerequipment.com/products/modeldetail.aspx?page=modeldetail§ion=P2GG&modelname=EU2000i&modelid=EU2000IAN
You can pick up good used Honda EU2000i's on craigslist for $750 each. That's what I did and mine were/are like new. I have hundreds of hours on mine. I bought a Yamaha 2400 for my son for $800 (craigslist) and it had less than 10 hours on it.
The other thing that should be kept in mind is that any generator that you get will spend most of it's running time @ low amp draw. The fuel consumption on a single Honda 2000w genset is (@ low draw) is about 1/2 of the bigger units. I typically get 10-12 hours off of a gallon of gas (it is rated @ 15 hrs per 1.1G). The Honda 3000Handi and the Yamaha2400 are both rated @ 5 hrs per gal (low draw). That's double the fuel consumption of a single Honda 2000 @ the same low draw amps.
Title:
Post by: oreo57 on Nov 18, 2009, 02:30 PM
Post by: oreo57 on Nov 18, 2009, 02:30 PM
Our Yamaha 2400 is great....but as said it's a little heavy so we just leave it in the truck bed when camping.
Title:
Post by: coach on Nov 18, 2009, 04:37 PM
Post by: coach on Nov 18, 2009, 04:37 PM
I have a $150 generator (//%22http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200313480_200313480%22) ($99 when I bought).
I take it boondocking and haven't needed it.
My friends insist I bring it to their property to operate the tacky lights boondocking. Since I bring it, we use the microwave (popcorn for the dog!) and the coffee maker.
It saved a big work project one time, an unexplained 3 hour power outage, running computer modem printer and fridge.
For the rare instances I 'need' it, it has been worth the $99.
If I get an 'RV' with air conditioning, I'd get a 3500/4000 champion with the 30A TT plug.
The Hondas are light and quieter but are only 900W rated or 1600W rated for the 2000i.
I take it boondocking and haven't needed it.
My friends insist I bring it to their property to operate the tacky lights boondocking. Since I bring it, we use the microwave (popcorn for the dog!) and the coffee maker.
It saved a big work project one time, an unexplained 3 hour power outage, running computer modem printer and fridge.
For the rare instances I 'need' it, it has been worth the $99.
If I get an 'RV' with air conditioning, I'd get a 3500/4000 champion with the 30A TT plug.
The Hondas are light and quieter but are only 900W rated or 1600W rated for the 2000i.
Title:
Post by: Hoagie on Nov 18, 2009, 05:59 PM
Post by: Hoagie on Nov 18, 2009, 05:59 PM
Quote from: wavery;212628but @ $2200 :yikes: I think that I would opt for 2 of the EU2000ia's @ $1100 each.
Plus the $200 for the Parallel Power Kit to get 30amps at 125volts.
Personally, I wouldn't want to lift the Handi up into my truck either; I was just offering an option. When all is said and done, I'd follow Wavery's advice and get two of the EU2000s. Each of transport and store. If you don't need air conditioning you only need to bring one. More versatile. Any if you can find used ones on Craig's List as he suggests, I go for it.
Can't remember where I found it, but if you do an Internet search you should run across a site that list "real world" noise ratings for different generators. Many manufacturers list their units' noise ratings only at idle or at a distance. The site I'm referring to (wish I could find it) independently tested a selection of generators and the Honda EU2000 consistently was the quietest, with the Yamaha a close second. (But at almost twice the weight.) So if a quiet campsite is a consideration, it's hard to beat the Honda.
JMHO FWIW
Title:
Post by: eo19 on Nov 20, 2009, 08:07 AM
Post by: eo19 on Nov 20, 2009, 08:07 AM
BRIGGS and STRATTON G1000M Elite Series Generator
I was able to pick one of these up for $200. Set the camper up yesterday to try it out. Seemed to work very well. Might be a little louder but for the price I am pleased.
I was able to pick one of these up for $200. Set the camper up yesterday to try it out. Seemed to work very well. Might be a little louder but for the price I am pleased.
Title:
Post by: coach on Nov 20, 2009, 08:38 AM
Post by: coach on Nov 20, 2009, 08:38 AM
Nice value!
B&S at one time were quick to point out that there is no standard for measuring generator's noise.
B&S at one time were quick to point out that there is no standard for measuring generator's noise.
Title:
Post by: wavery on Nov 20, 2009, 12:27 PM
Post by: wavery on Nov 20, 2009, 12:27 PM
Quote from: eo19;212658BRIGGS and STRATTON G1000M Elite Series Generator
I was able to pick one of these up for $200. Set the camper up yesterday to try it out. Seemed to work very well. Might be a little louder but for the price I am pleased.
That's a decent price. The nice thing is, if you decide to get a larger genset, you shouldn't have any trouble getting your $ out of this one.
You tend to see a lot of used 1000W gen-sets for sale. People buy them, get hooked on having 110V but frustrated that they won't really run many appliances (microwave, coffee pot, heater etc). They end up selling the 1000W unit with very low hours and buying a larger one.
If you are satisfied with it charging your batteries and running small stuff, you should be good to go. I would suggest using a good 3-stage ~7A battery charger for charging your batteries though. Just plug the battery charger into the gen. The "Built-in charger" is pretty worthless in those things.
Let us know how the noise level is after your 1st camp-out. It would be good to do a product review on it.
Title:
Post by: oreo57 on Nov 20, 2009, 02:29 PM
Post by: oreo57 on Nov 20, 2009, 02:29 PM
Check these units (//%22http://ramsond.com/gasgen.php%22) out, not a bad price and low Db's.
Title:
Post by: wavery on Nov 20, 2009, 06:24 PM
Post by: wavery on Nov 20, 2009, 06:24 PM
Quote from: oreo57;212669Check these units out, not a bad price and low Db's.
Now that should give Honda and Yamaha a run for their $.
http://ramsond.com/proddetail.php?prod=SINEMATE2500&cat=Inverter Generators
I think that you should buy one and give us a report on it.
2500W, electric starter, 59db and only 57# for $550............... almost sounds too good to be true. If I were in the market, I'd buy one. :sombraro:
Title:
Post by: oreo57 on Nov 20, 2009, 08:02 PM
Post by: oreo57 on Nov 20, 2009, 08:02 PM
I agree Wayne, but I'm not in the market either. I wonder if the 59 Db rating is at low. which means the high could be noisey. But still a great deal.
Title:
Post by: mickeys4 on Nov 21, 2009, 09:39 PM
Post by: mickeys4 on Nov 21, 2009, 09:39 PM
Not pushing Honda generators but their website is very informative about generators in general,different types,amount of power needed etc.Check these links.
http://www.hondapowerequipment.com/products/generators/content.aspx?asset=gg_choose
http://www.hondapowerequipment.com/products/generators/content.aspx?asset=gg_howmuchpower#Determining
http://www.hondapowerequipment.com/products/generators/content.aspx?asset=gg_choose
http://www.hondapowerequipment.com/products/generators/content.aspx?asset=gg_howmuchpower#Determining
Title:
Post by: He Ruide on Nov 22, 2009, 11:31 AM
Post by: He Ruide on Nov 22, 2009, 11:31 AM
Note the Ramsond 59 dB measurements were made are 21 feet compared to Honda's which are made at 9 feet. One of these days I'm going measure the dB of my EU 3000 and EU 2000 at 21 feet so I'll know how these generators compared to each other.
RUide
RUide
Title:
Post by: wavery on Nov 22, 2009, 12:45 PM
Post by: wavery on Nov 22, 2009, 12:45 PM
Quote from: He Ruide;212729Note the Ramsond 59 dB measurements were made are 21 feet compared to Honda's which are made at 9 feet. One of these days I'm going measure the dB of my EU 3000 and EU 2000 at 21 feet so I'll know how these generators compared to each other.
RUide
The other thing to remember is that the Honda EU2000i is rated @ 53db @ 9' (1/4 load)
The Ramsund is rated @ 59db @ 21' but does not stipulate the load %. One could assume that is @ 1/4 load also.
59db is 6x louder than 53db @ over twice the distance.
I sure wish that someone would buy that thing and bring it to one of our camp-outs........We could do a real world comparison on it.........then I'll lend that person my Honda for the remainder of the camp-out so that we can live in peace.....:sombraro:
Title:
Post by: He Ruide on Nov 22, 2009, 02:15 PM
Post by: He Ruide on Nov 22, 2009, 02:15 PM
Wavery,
Very good point about the load rating. The other issue is which of the four sides of the generator was the sound meter pointed at. I've seen manufacturers manipulate all three to make their generators look better.
Yes maybe we should have a generator shoot out at a camping ground next year. My actual preference would be to standardize the RV generator sound measurements so we could make apple to apple comparisons.
Rudie
Very good point about the load rating. The other issue is which of the four sides of the generator was the sound meter pointed at. I've seen manufacturers manipulate all three to make their generators look better.
Yes maybe we should have a generator shoot out at a camping ground next year. My actual preference would be to standardize the RV generator sound measurements so we could make apple to apple comparisons.
Rudie
Title:
Post by: oreo57 on Nov 22, 2009, 02:47 PM
Post by: oreo57 on Nov 22, 2009, 02:47 PM
So we need a gennie pig :D
Title:
Post by: coach on Nov 22, 2009, 05:00 PM
Post by: coach on Nov 22, 2009, 05:00 PM
Let's not compare power/energy to loudness as precieved by the human ear, that's wouldn't be correct.
Another complication is that the human ear does not hear linearly either. Although loudness is subjective, most people perceive one sound to be twice as loud as another, when there is a 10-fold increase in energy, or a difference of about 10 db. So a 60 db sound sounds twice as loud as a 50 db one, although there is 10 times more energy in it. Also, it is interesting to note that most people cann ot discern any difference in perceived loudness of less than 3 db. That means that the energy in the sound has to double, before someone can notice any difference.
Site galore for the searching...
Another complication is that the human ear does not hear linearly either. Although loudness is subjective, most people perceive one sound to be twice as loud as another, when there is a 10-fold increase in energy, or a difference of about 10 db. So a 60 db sound sounds twice as loud as a 50 db one, although there is 10 times more energy in it. Also, it is interesting to note that most people cann ot discern any difference in perceived loudness of less than 3 db. That means that the energy in the sound has to double, before someone can notice any difference.
Site galore for the searching...
Title:
Post by: JohnandLeann on Nov 23, 2009, 02:02 AM
Post by: JohnandLeann on Nov 23, 2009, 02:02 AM
We were camped next to someone a few years ago with Honda gen and we really could not hear it running. The vacuum cleaner inside the trailer was noisier than the generator. They had a little boy and mom was a clean freak. She was always cleaning something.
Title:
Post by: AustinBoston on Nov 23, 2009, 11:39 AM
Post by: AustinBoston on Nov 23, 2009, 11:39 AM
Quote from: JohnandLeann;212751They had a little boy and mom was a clean freak. She was always cleaning something.
People like that should not be camping. :eyecrazy:
Austin