Battery Not Working

[Kampur]

We own a 2003 Coleman Carmel.  We usually camp at electric sites.  On a recent dry camping trip we discovered that we had no battery power.  Since it was the original battery, we assumed it had done its time and replaced it.  This did not solve the problem.  The trailer runs fine on electricity so its not the switch on the galley.  We did not have this problem before but must admit it had been a while since dry camped so not sure when the problem started.  Any ideas on what the problem might be.  I'm new to RV repair and am hoping to avoid the cost of going to the dealer.

[wavery]

We own a 2003 Coleman Carmel.  We usually camp at electric sites.  On a recent dry camping trip we discovered that we had no battery power.  Since it was the original battery, we assumed it had done its time and replaced it.  This did not solve the problem.  The trailer runs fine on electricity so its not the switch on the galley.  We did not have this problem before but must admit it had been a while since dry camped so not sure when the problem started.  Any ideas on what the problem might be.  I'm new to RV repair and am hoping to avoid the cost of going to the dealer.

The most common problem is reversed polarity.

White is Ground and black is positive. A lot of people get that confused. If you did reverse polarity, it probably blew the fuse inside the converter.

Make sure that the white plug on the trailer tongue is connected.

[Kampur]

I will check this.  Would this fuse be visible or would it be the famous hidden fuse I have seen mentioned in other posts?  I have a WFCO converter.

[tlhdoc]

There is a self resetting circuit breaker on the positive wire on your wiring harness.  Make sure you have the wires correctly attached to the battery.  Is the new battery charged?  Hope you solve your problem quickly.

[Kampur]

I've checked the positive/negative wires as well as the circuit breaker wire and seems good.  It is possible that reverse polarity occured way back since we had not used the battery in a while.  

I attempted to remove the 30 amp fuse today with a fuse puller.  I was afraid to rip the whole thing off the converter so decided to check back on Forum before causing any permanent damage.  Is it normal that it's so hard to remove?

My converter is a WFCO 8725

[wavery]

I've checked the positive/negative wires as well as the circuit breaker wire and seems good.  It is possible that reverse polarity occured way back since we had not used the battery in a while.  

I attempted to remove the 30 amp fuse today with a fuse puller.  I was afraid to rip the whole thing off the converter so decided to check back on Forum before causing any permanent damage.  Is it normal that it's so hard to remove?

My converter is a WFCO 8725

I'm not familiar with that converter. My converter has a separate glass fuse inside the box. I have to take the back panel off of the converter to get to it.

If your lights & things are working when plugged into 110v, the fuses on the front panel are fine.

To get out a stuck fuse, make sure that the camper is disconnected from any power then spray the fuse holder lightly with a little WD40. Let it sit for a minute, tap on the fuse with the back of a screwdriver then pull it out. It should come out easily.

[Kampur]

I'm not familiar with that converter. My converter has a separate glass fuse inside the box. I have to take the back panel off of the converter to get to it.

If your lights & things are working when plugged into 110v, the fuses on the front panel are fine.

To get out a stuck fuse, make sure that the camper is disconnected from any power then spray the fuse holder lightly with a little WD40. Let it sit for a minute, tap on the fuse with the back of a screwdriver then pull it out. It should come out easily.

So if everything runs fine on AC then the fuses in the front are fine?  I've also read somewhere that if AC is running the converter is fine.  Is this correct?

[mike4947]

In a word Nope. Your converter is what we call a works in a box electrical system.
It starts with the shore power cord connecting to two 120 volt AC circuit breakers. A 20 amp breaker is usually reserved for use with an air conditioner. The 15 amp circuit breaker powers all other 120 volt applications. The outlets with the first one being a GFCI are daisy chained off this breaker, as is the 120 volt heater circuit for the fridge. Along with those is a connection to the true "converter" which is a transformer/rectifier that converts 120 volt AC to 12 volt DC. Attached to it is the 12 volt buss and the fuses for the various 12 volt circuits.
So you can have a complete "converter" failure and still have all the 120 volt items work fine.

[Kampur]

In a word Nope. Your converter is what we call a works in a box electrical system.
It starts with the shore power cord connecting to two 120 volt AC circuit breakers. A 20 amp breaker is usually reserved for use with an air conditioner. The 15 amp circuit breaker powers all other 120 volt applications. The outlets with the first one being a GFCI are daisy chained off this breaker, as is the 120 volt heater circuit for the fridge. Along with those is a connection to the true "converter" which is a transformer/rectifier that converts 120 volt AC to 12 volt DC. Attached to it is the 12 volt buss and the fuses for the various 12 volt circuits.
So you can have a complete "converter" failure and still have all the 120 volt items work fine.

What could cause converter failure?

[wavery]

In a word Nope. Your converter is what we call a works in a box electrical system.
It starts with the shore power cord connecting to two 120 volt AC circuit breakers. A 20 amp breaker is usually reserved for use with an air conditioner. The 15 amp circuit breaker powers all other 120 volt applications. The outlets with the first one being a GFCI are daisy chained off this breaker, as is the 120 volt heater circuit for the fridge. Along with those is a connection to the true "converter" which is a transformer/rectifier that converts 120 volt AC to 12 volt DC. Attached to it is the 12 volt buss and the fuses for the various 12 volt circuits.
So you can have a complete "converter" failure and still have all the 120 volt items work fine.

You can also have a converter that switches the 120v AC to 12v DC but it may not work with the battery hooked up. This is usually due to a blown fuse in the converter or the time delay circuit breaker on the battery. If your 12v lights are working while plugged in to 120v shore power, your converter is probably fine.

The one thing that I didn't mention is, some posters have reported a faulty wire going from the battery to the converter. I didn't mention it because you should check that fuse first. If it's OK, then your wiring is the next target. I replaced my battery to converter wires with 10g marine grade wire.

[Kampur]

You can also have a converter that switches the 120v AC to 12v DC but it may not work with the battery hooked up. This is usually due to a blown fuse in the converter or the time delay circuit breaker on the battery.

The one thing that I didn't mention is, some posters have reporter a faulty wire going from the battery to the converter. I didn't mention it because you should check that fuse first. If it's OK, then your wiring is the next target.

So this fuse would not be in the front panel, but rather inside the converter? Is this the case with all converters?

[wavery]

So this fuse would not be in the front panel, but rather inside the converter? Is this the case with all converters?

That's what I don't know. I can only say that is true for the Centurion Converter.

If the converter manufacturers were smart, they'd put a simple diode in the converter so that power could only flow one way. I don't understand why they put a fuse in the system instead. I guess it saves them 29 cents per unit. :rolleyes:

[wavery]

OK......I did a little research....is this your converter?
https://bestconverter.3dcartstores.com/WFCO-8725-Power-Center_p_83-50.html

It appears that the WFCO converter does indeed have reverse polarity protection, which means they built it with a diode in the line....

That takes you to the wires running from your battery to the converter or the neg (white) wire running from the battery to the frame. It could be as simple as a dirty connection at the frame. However, I would take this opportunity to change those wires anyway.

I don't know where Fleetwood buys their wire but it is real crap. The wire corrodes right in two, in the middle of the wire. When I replaced the wires on my 2002 Coleman PU, I stripped the insulation off of the wires, just to have a look. They were all corroded inside, from one end to the other. This was a SoCal, garage stored trailer, all it's life (except while camping). When I hooked up the new wires, the voltage inside the camper went from 11.9 to 12.5 on a full battery.

[Kampur]

OK......I did a little research....is this your converter?
https://bestconverter.3dcartstores.com/WFCO-8725-Power-Center_p_83-50.html

It appears that the WFCO converter does indeed have reverse polarity protection, which means they built it with a diode in the line....

That takes you to the wires running from your battery to the converter or the neg (white) wire running from the battery to the frame. It could be as simple as a dirty connection at the frame. However, I would take this opportunity to change those wires anyway.

I don't know where Fleetwood buys their wire but it is real crap. The wire corrodes right in two, in the middle of the wire. When I replaced the wires on my 2002 Coleman PU, I stripped the insulation off of the wires, just to have a look. They were all corroded inside, from one end to the other. This was a SoCal, garage stored trailer, all it's life (except while camping). When I hooked up the new wires, the voltage inside the camper went from 11.9 to 12.5 on a full battery.

Yes this is my converter, except the fuses on mine run horizontially.  

I spoke the dealer today and they told me to check the 30amp fuse -green one  (re reverse polarity...)  I managed to get it out and replaced with a new one.  Still no power.  The dealer also mentioned that if everything runs on AC then converter is fine.  

So you think its the wires?  Not sure I can do this job.  Might have to end up taking it in for repair after all.

[wavery]

Yes this is my converter, except the fuses on mine run horizontially.  

I spoke the dealer today and they told me to check the 30amp fuse -green one  (re reverse polarity...)  I managed to get it out and replaced with a new one.  Still no power.  The dealer also mentioned that if everything runs on AC then converter is fine.  

So you think its the wires?  Not sure I can do this job.  Might have to end up taking it in for repair after all.

Balony.........you can do it. If you took the converter out by yourself, you're half way there.

Follow the black wire from the battery to where it passes into the camper. Have someone stand outside and pull it in and out. You go inside and see which wire is moving. You will see where the wire goes into a plug. You just need to replace that wire from the battery all the way to that plug.

Next, follow the white (ground) wire down to where it attaches to the frame. Replace that wire as well. The wire from the frame up inside to the converter is probably a solid copper wire and that is probably OK.

You can run the ground (white) wire straight to the battery. The black (positive) wire will need some sort of connector on it. Go to your local auto parts store and ask them for a single pole connector.

I bought one of these:
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=92688

The thing with this is, it needs to be mounted in some kind of box so that it doesn't get shorted out.