RE: Hybrid Questions Please Help

[alan]

 
My family and I are considering upgrading from our pop-up to a hybrid, but we are having a hard time deciding weather or not just to purchase a TT...
 We want the convenience of being able to get in and out with out popping up.
 Also, I like the sleeping capacity of the hybrids, but our concerns are with heating and cooling.  Are they easier to heat and cool than a pop-up?  Has anyone experienced leaking around the bunk ends when closed?  How do they tow?
 Any and all info or opinions on hybrids will be greatly appreciated!
 
 Thanks in advance!
 Alan.

[Camper Dan]

 alan
Alan,
 
 First of all, WELCOME!  I see you are new around here.[]
 
 You think you want a TT?  No popuping up![]
 
      That s what makes TT s so popular.  No canvas.[][]  The dark side.
 
 Also, I like the sleeping capacity of the hybrids, but our concerns are with heating and cooling.
 
      If you use solar bunk end covers heating and cooling is not so much of a problem.  I made bunk end covers (2) for about $75-$80 or so.  At night, you will never have a problem cooling a hybrid.  Heating a hybrid at night, well, it has bunks ends like a popup,...if you are on the outside of the bunk and it is 20 degrees out...you d probably want an electric blanket.[]  In not so cold weather, I ve heated with just a ceramic heater (cheep$$$).
 
 Are they easier to heat and cool than a pop-up?
 
      The walls and floors on hybrids have insulation rated anywhere from R-4 to R-7 depending on who makes them.  That just leaves the bunk ends...which I just covered.  They also install higher BTU rated furnaces in hybrids than they do in popups.  A hybrid is going to sleep a little cooler than a TT.
 
 Has anyone experienced leaking around the bunk ends when closed?
 
      Haven t heard of any leak problems due to design... only leaks I ve heard of recently are due to operator/owner error when closing or a rare defective seal.  They are easy to close.  You just have to watch what you are doing.  You practice with it at home a few times before you use it.
 
 How do they tow?
 
      They tow fine...if you have properly matched your tow vehicle to the trailer s length and weight.  I tow a Kiwi 23D (4700 lbs. loaded) with a F-150 Super Cab (5300 lbs. loaded, with a trailer tow weight rating of 7000 lbs.,  75% rule[]).  The 139"  wheelbase makes this F-150 a very stable TV (wheelbase rule of thumb[]).  I have the 4.6 liter motor, but wish I had the 5.4 liter motor.   Some of the smaller (lighter and shorter) hybrids can be towed with a Chevy Astro Van (4.3 motor, w/tow package).
 
      If you are wanting a TT...you are going to need a full sized something with a big V-8 to tow with anyway.
 
      My Kiwi can sleep 2 large adults, 4 averaged size adults and two small children (on dinette bunk, if 5  tall or less).  It is 23 7"  when towing, 27 1"  when setup.  
 
 It all comes down to $$$$.  If you can afford a large enough truck to tow a large enough trailer.  It s the balancing act we all go through when making our choices.  Towing a hybrid, which basicly tows like a travel trailer, is going to require a larger vehicle to safely deal with the forces exerted on it.  It tows different than a popup (higher, heavier, wider & longer).
 
 Compare the size TT you will need vs. hybrid to meet your sleeping requirements.  Then check the weights and lengths.  Then you will see how large a vehicle you will need to have ...to safely get the towing done.

[alan]

 alan
Camper Dan,
 Thank you for your reply!!  Actually, we are looking at the 23D and I will be towing it with an F-150 with the bigger V-8.
 Do you have any sway problems?  We live in west Texas and it gets very windy here.
 
 Thanks,
 Alan.

[fivegonefishing]

 alan
Hi Alan, welcome to PUT.  We just purchased a Palomino Hybrid which is almost identical in floor plan to the kiwi, we had a Jayco pop up and although I just love my pop up, with three small kids, the idea of easier set up and break down really seemed attractive to me.  Haven t actually camped in it yet but from everyone has told me thus far, I don t think we made the wrong decision.
 
 Good luck,
 
 Tammy

[campertime]

 alan
Alan - In my opinion the hybrids have an advantages over TT s
 
 1. lighter weight
 2. beds don t take up floor space
 3. opening the bunkends provides a nive view and breeze
 4. less $$$
 
 Main reason we chose the 23 foot hybrid over a 23 ft travel trailer was because the inside of the TT was taken up by beds and seemed real closed in. The TT also weighed about 1100lbs more and also $2200 more with no slideout. Of course the downside to a hybrid is your still dealing with air and heat loss as well as rain with the bunkends.
 
 good luck in your search []

[Camper Dan]

 alan
Alan,[]
 
 Sway problems...none!  But I....well, here s what I ve got.  A  98 F-150 Super Cab, 139"  wheelbase, w/fiberglass cap, 4.6 V-8, auto, 3.55 rear axle, factory tow package, Monroe Insta-Trac shocks, SuperSprings progressive rate helper/anti sway spring set, Goodyear Wrangler AT/S LT-265 75R16 (load range " D" ) tires,  Prodigy brake control, Reese WDH with single pad friction sway control.  When towing, I inflate the truck tires to their 65 PSI max.  Takes the sway factor out of the tires.[]
 
 I use a tongue scale and keep my tongue weight around 650-700 lbs. (that s about 14% of the 4700 lb. loaded weight).  I also added a Super Chip " Flip Chip" , K&N Gen II FIPK air filter system and a 3"  K&N cat-back S.S. exhaust system.
 
 I have occassionally experienced the " bow wave"  effect while passing or being passed by semi s/ fifth wheelers, etc..  The greater the difference in speed, the greater the effect.
 
 Although I have been towing something or other, for some 30 odd years, including several boats for 11 years, I have only logged about 1000+ miles towing my Kiwi 23D.  We have only had it since last June.  Our longest trip was about 180 miles one way.
 
 I generally tow around 50-60 MPH ( Jayco recommends 55 MPH max towing
 speed).  However, going up Interstate hills in Ohio and Indiana, we have slowed down to 40-45 MPH.
 
 If you have the 5.4 motor in your F-150, you will actually be getting better mileage, when towing, than I do.  Our towing MPG = 7.5 to 9.  I get about 18- 21 MPG not towing (hwy.).
 
 Hope this helps![]
 
 

[dee106]

 alan
good job Dan!
 we have a 2500 series full size chevy conversion van, v-8 and it does the job, ours is a bit heavier with the slide out, but we are 21 ft long, but everything Dan said is on the money!
  we love ours and no leaks, and it is warmer, except the back bunk, there you need an electric blanket! we too use the solar bunkend blankets outside in the summer and winter helps alot. and it s nice to have a full bathroom, an oven, a full fridge, mirco wave, and stereo ! and like dan said having the beds on the wings gives you much more room inside, specially on these rainy and snowy outings!

[alan]

 alan
Thanks for all of the help!
 A

[stricsm]

 alan
If there is a concern about heating the beds in the bunk ends, you might want to consider a model with heated beds.

[Y-Guy]

 alan
We have a 23  Hybrid I checked our a friend 23  TT and was glad we had our Hybrid as we had a lot more room that wasn t all bed or beds that converted to tables.  Yes there is some setup time, but the space is something I really appreciate when our family is all in the camper.

[PopUpTrio]

 alan
Alan,
 
 We used to live in West Texas (Midland) and if you re camping around there, I can t see a reason to worry about heat loss. (ha) Seriously, we are now in East Texas and just went from a popup to a hybrid.  Keeping it heated and or A/C controlled is not a problem if you follow the tips provided by reading the message boards.  We use the solar covers in extreme heat and flip them in extreme cold.  Most of the time we don t really need them.   As mentioned, the floorspace the hybrid gives by not using it all up on beds is worth any small disadvantage they may bring.  And, I just couldn t give up the wonderful open, breezy feeling when the ends are unzipped.  Good luck on whatever you decide!