I'm back - kinda long

[birol]

Well I agree with Dave ! I kept pestering him to lower the price and include the board with the magazine ! And lo and behold he did !

My take  on this ? I don't know Dave, I met him once, he was pleasant, he was polite, that's all I know about him, but you know what ? He is putting his neck out for this place and the magazine and he will do whatever pleases him at the end of the day, and I respect that, whether I agree with him or not.

His impression on me is that he is a very tolerant guy who is doing this for us, and I appreciate that too ! yeah he wants money out of it as well, we all want to do something we like and make money, don't we ? I say lets just post, discuss, agree, disagree, but be polite and have fun and make sure that others also have an opportunity to have fun.

There ! This is what I think

Here is one to Dave !  :!  and to PUT :!  and my virtual friends :!

[bearbait]

Elisa,  you humor me!
 
You and your private country club clique are personally responsible for driving off many longtime members including Forestcreature and Genef and God only knows how many others whom were tired of your rants.  You post in some threads about some sort of eutopia that you think exsists when the reality is that this board has been run in the ground by just a few in the offending clique.
 
Kelly merely asked for an explanation for your comments and you automatically go on the offensive and attack her telling her to "just relax" with your seriously offensive undertones.  You complain on the one hand about "trolls and troublemakers"  but yet when you do the exact same thing as your remarks in the post Kelly questioned,  you feel the need to "spin" it.  Well I'm here to say enough is enough,  it's not your place to call the kettle black.
 
I can't for the life of me figure out why your cliuqe feels so insecure about themselves and constantly defending this board or it's members or whatever else is in your hidden agenda,  why can't this board just exsist like any other neighborhood?  Do you tell your neighbors in Georgia how to live to?  Do you tell them if they don't like what you have to say,  they can just move?  Is that your idea of a "Peacable Kingdom"?  Where everyone serves under your own personal agenda?
 
And the comment about keeping off topic stuff in the campfire,  well it seems your clique was very successfull in steering this thread in a way to get your agenda out there in the general section.  I come here to read about camping and refrain from going to the campfire section and posting because that seems to be the cliques "territory".  But once again I see that FLUFF has  spilled over into other area's in this message board,  when are the moderators ever going to take control of this infestation?
 
People whom want to stay have that right,  those that want to leave do also,  whatever their reason.  Your clique does not need to reinforce anyones reasons for coming or going,  it's a communtiy,  let it be one.
 
Anyone new that may be reading this,  I'm sorry in advance for posting this and subjecting you to this clique issue thats rampade on this board.  But this aforemnentioned group has run a lot of good people off this board for good and the comments your reading in this thread by these people are just more attempts to drive the remainder of them off.
 
In closing,  I think it's time for me to start posting again after a long winter and try and add to this community once again, in whatever way I can.  But lets hope enough of us can ban together and hold off the agenda of these few people as they try and control this entire board.

[NightOwl]

BearBait old Buddy I kinda figured you were nearby.:W  WELCOME BACK!!   :-()  :-()  :-()  Kill the fatted calf everyone--It's time for us all to celebrate the return of the prodigal camper  

Does this return appearance mean you are going to pay your $20.00 to continue to  belong to our little country club?:J  One thing about it, with your return no one will ever be able to complain the place is dull and predictable

Now, if the rest of those who are your special friends will all just come back and pay to belong next year, Dave will be making more money, the magazine circ figures will grow nicely,  and we can all just relax and enjoy ourselves together like we used to in the good old days.

It is amazingly rewarding to see your claim  that I have the power to singlehandedly  control this bunch of weirdos (my "Clicque" --by the way, that is the correct way to spell it)  and even drive some of them away, or in your case, bring them back to life like Lazurus.  See if you can get the rest of them to start posting now.  I always thought your remarks  and your  opinions were unusually  interesting and creative even when I didnt agree with them. :-()  :-()

Stick around and let's have some more lively exchanges. :p

[David Roder]

Thanks for doing what you do and glad you stuck around.  This is a great web site and I'm brand new so I've only recieved one magazine so far, but I liked it just fine. Especially the ads, it's great to see what's available and more importantly, where to get it.

[brainpause]

************
Back to the magazine and Dave
************

I am thankful for the magazine, because it pertains to POPUP CAMPING. I have picked up other magazines and read through them. Yes, it takes longer to get through these "thicker" magazines. But pull out of the other magazines the things that pertain to popup camping, and see how much magazine you have left. You will have most of the other magazines still sitting there. That's the reason I like PUT.

Thanks Dave for your hard work.

And to all who would like to see other things, and possibly "more" things, write an article! I did, and it got published, so try it!

Larry

[NightOwl]

BTW, Larry I meant to thank you for what was a very helpful article.  When one is in the middle of a medical emergency is  no time to suddenly think of all the records you need like what is Johnny's blood type, etc.  (We never thought of it when we camped before and we were lucky we never needed them, but if I had it to do over, we'd have had that info with us each time, especially as we took several trips thousands of miles from home that lasted for weeks!)

And your remark about the volume of popup info in other magazines is well-taken!  I subscribed to Trailer Life for 2 years and it had a lot of useful stuff in it for RV owners of other types, but almost nothing  about popups.

What many of us know about popups, we have learned from this board or from the magazine.  I bet if all the old posts on our various hostsites had been published, you would have the definitive book on popup camping :W

Gosh, I think back to all  the really useful stuff I learned about towing and weight limits through this board, and how to tow REALLY safely and it amazes me how little  we knew about this stuff with our old Skamper.   I still remember A_B's experience when he tried to induce sway on the highway before their long trip and how quickly it got out of control.  It was a GREAT  post and a cheap lesson for the rest of us in safety!  That experience later appeared in Popup Times and probably saved at least a  few people from horrendous mistakes.

I wonder if we could get Dave to reprint it for the sake of newer members?

[brainpause]

BTW, Larry I meant to thank you for what was a very helpful article.  

You are welcome. I enjoyed writing it, and sharing with others what I want/need when patients hit the doors.

I still remember A_B's experience when he tried to induce sway on the highway before their long trip and how quickly it got out of control.

It WAS a great article.

Reminds me of my pre PUT days when I was pulling a small TT with my S10. I thought I could pull anything because of its strong 4.3L V6, even though I knew its tow rating was only 3000#. I know that TT was well above that limit. But I didn't care. I just wanted to camp in something off the ground. I know that some more knowledgeable people than myself at the time were grimacing and pointing as I bounced down the road, happily getting 12 miles to the gallon pulling that monster (it was old and HEAVY, even though it was short; it was so heavy, that there was no fudging when hooking up. I had to get the ball directly under the hitch.).

Larry

[brainpause]

Funny thing just hit me....

I have an article published that is medical in nature, in PopUp Times Magazine. And then you come to the board, and I have a disclaimer that reads "Do not take medical advice from me."

Larry

[Firefyter-Emt]

Awh Heck.. We all just need to go CAMPING!!

[B-flat]

....and Fire is another one who goes a long way back on this board and who has stuck with PUT for a long time.  Many of us go back a long, long way to the beginning of PUT.....the magazine and the message board.  It really is the only one dedicated to Pop Up camping.  All of us keep coming back again and again and we really appreciate what Dave has created.

[griffsmom]

All of us keep coming back again and again and we really appreciate what Dave has created.

Some of us never left in the first place...

[NightOwl]

Some of us never left in the first place...

And what's more--WE NEVER WILL!!
 :#   :U  :#   :C  :#

Too much fun yet to be had , too many good people to share that fun with , too many popup  things yet  to learn, and  too many camping trips still to be to shared! :-()  :-()  :-()  

[birol]

You said it very well Nightowl !

[Kelly]

Kelly, yes, it is just as you feared--you ARE " "reading me wrong."

And, nah, you're all worked up over nothing. Dont worry so much, just enjoy the board and relax.

My apologies to anyone who thinks I might have been trying to hijack this thread.  I'm not.  

I have a very good friend who tells me that PopUpTimes saved my life.  She's right.  Some of the people I met here have cared for me during a very difficult year-and-a-half.  The point is I do enjoy the boards, Elisa.  I post when I can and read as much as possible.  My concern was that people would read your post and not feel welcome here.  I want the magazine and the boards to succeed as much as the next person.  

Thank you for clarifying your points.

And since you are a member here in good standing and not a troll or a behind-the-scenes member of the Troublemakers Clicque, you can rest assured that any swinging doors I might mention certainly dont refer to you

Since I don't know who is in the Troublemakers Clicque, might I just point out that I could be a behind-the-scenes member and not realize it?  I have formed many friendships here.  

The thing I have loved about this place is the way friendships were formed without regard to any of the dreaded 'isms' in our daily lives (religion, sex, race, etc).  We are a community of Camping Fools ~ all of us.  Saddens me to see people throw around terms designed to be divisive.  (that includes you, Bearbait ...)


.... and now I will shut up about this subject and get back to my regularly scheduled life  

[NightOwl]

My apologies to anyone who thinks I might have been trying to hijack this thread.  I'm not.  

  The point is I do enjoy the boards, Elisa.  I post when I can and read as much as possible.  My concern was that people would read your post and not feel welcome here.  I want the magazine and the boards to succeed as much as the next person.  

Thank you for clarifying your points.

Since I don't know who is in the Troublemakers Clicque, might I just say point out that I could be a behind-the-scenes member and not realize it?  I have formed many friendships here.  

The thing I have loved about this place is the way friendships were formed without regard to any of the dreaded 'isms' in our daily lives (religion, sex, race, etc).  We are a community of Camping Fools ~ all of us.  Saddens me to see people throw around terms designed to be divisive.  (that includes you, Bearbait ...)

.... and now I will shut up about this subject and get back to my regularly scheduled life  

================================================================================

Kelly, I am truly sorry if I made you, or anyone else of good heart and intentions, feel unwelcome.   I agree with you on many points, including the ones you made above.  Most of us--if we're lucky--have PUT  friends we e-mail and visit with privately. In this respect, the board has often served as  "matchmaker."  It's one of the great fringe benefits of belonging here as many of us are aware.  

And, yes,  deliberately hurtful labels dont belong here.   It is a very pleasant and relaxed  place the way Dave and the moderators are running it now.   Everyone can enjoy a friendly atmosphere where we can be silly or serious and sometimes the two kind of blend together in one post--it just cant always be avoided.    

Newer members might find it useful to know that because of the policy for open-ended subject matter at The Campfire, it often serves as a home base  for people who--for many reasons--are   in need of extra emotional support.     And sometimes we all fall into this group and need to vent our emotions in pure silliness or "fluff"

Because of posting "fluff"  two members who were  at the ends of their ropes several months ago  were almost  forced from this board by unkind remarks This  kind of treatment of people we ALL KNEW  were  at a disastrous  point in their lives, bothered some of us..  (They only stayed because behind the scenes  a bunch of us literally  begged them to.). When several of us objected to the continuing unpleasantness,   those who started the complaints   decided  to move on.   I dont imagine they miss being here since they felt the board had become boring and meaningless.

You said a friend told you this board saved your life, Kelly.  This is why I think  we shouldn't  deny this comfort and companionship to others in need even if they should  post 7 pages of silliness at  The Campfire in a day. And EVEN if this spills over now and then into other forums or someone hi-jacks a thread briefly; this  is not the worst thing in the world and wont bring PUT crashing down.

Unfortunately, once people begin to criticise  others for little infractions in posting content, the habit to pick people apart grows and  it kind of  makes some of the shyer or newer members feel uneasy in case they  might make a "mistake"  someone  with strict standards night complain about.  ( I'm glad this kind of remark is something no one has  to worry about anymore )
 
Other than  deliberate incivility toward the vulnerable  and the prophecies  :screwy:  that the board would fail when Dave changed over to subscription memberships, the board has run marvelously well and we've  had some fantastic times together.:-()   It's a great, comfortable,comforting place for emotional support and useful information--a place to share tears and laughter and respectful disagreement, as well as our love--and knowledge--of camping.  

Probably it's  this comraderie Dave had in mind when he decided to keep the board going and not give up the magazine (Also by the way, your observations seemed far from hi-jacking; rather, looked to me like they came  naturally  out of  some remarks in Dave's original post. )

I'm glad you realize I was not describing you as a  "troublemaker." Kelly.  And  the discussion you and I have been having certainly proves  that people here have plenty of  room to disagree about details or semantics, and do it courteously.  :!  

Have to say, I LOVE your phrase "Camping Fools"  because that is surely what we all are!:#

.As for  my use of term The Peaceable Kingdom"  I hope it's very clear by now that  I dont think we should try to be Steptford Campers. :eyecrazy:  I mean, my DH and I have lived "Peaceably" together for over 46 years, but that SURELY does NOT mean we always agree.  :banghead: