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RE: Help! My TV back end is sinking!

Started by kathybrj, Jul 17, 2003, 08:27 AM

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campingeyedoc

Sep 28, 2003, 07:05 PM
 We had pulled our Coleman Mesa with 4 bikes on the back of 1995 Astro for 2 years with no problem. On our recent trip to Cape Cod with new 2001 Astro with the exact same setup, I found that the back end of the Astro was probably 6 inches lower than the old Astro (had to shorten the tow chains by a few links). This also created a tremendous amount of sway with something as simple as making a gradual turn, much less changing lanes or trying to avoid something in the road. I had onlt a class iii hitch with no additional sway control because I never had a problem with the old TV. Why would this happen with the new model; of the same TV? It seems to ride fine without the popup. Could it need different springs or shocks, even though it drives fine? And what sway control is best. I have a U-Haul hitch. Would weight distributing bars alone be enough to bring the back end up (especially since I had no problem with old Astro)? What is the difference between the weight distribution bars and a single flat sway bar.

kathybrj

#1
Jul 17, 2003, 08:27 AM
 campingeyedocWell, all I can say is that we own a 1997 GMC Safari and tow a 2002 Utah. We purchased a Reese mini 350 and it alleviates the sag in the backend of the van and gives us some sway control.
 
 In a week or so, we are replacing the shocks all around, because they haven t been done in a while (we got the van 18 months ago).
 
 I can t say why it happened with the newer vehicle. Difference in shocks, maybe?
 
 Check into a Reese 350 or 400. It should help with the sag.

angelsmom10

#2
Jul 17, 2003, 08:42 AM
 campingeyedocSince we got the new PU, the truck sags a little in the rear.  DH is looking into " air bags"  to put in the springs.  Anyone had any experience in this?  Best type?  Best place to buy?
 
 

AustinBoston

#3
Jul 17, 2003, 09:14 AM
 campingeyedocCampingeyedoc,
 
 No matter what anybody tells you, DO NOT use air bags, helper springs, air shocks, or other suspension enhancements with your Astro.
 
 1) Chevy says not to.
 2) They void the warranty (if any).
 3) They interfere with the ABS brakes...which don t work that well to begin with.
 4) They don t solve the real problem, which is excess weight on the back of the vehicle.
 
 The best solution is a weight distributing hitch (WDH), which is what Chevy recommends.  If you use the Reese Mini-350, it has friction sway control built-in.
 
 If you use the Reese Mini-400, you can add a separate sway bar.  I believe the Mini-400 is easier to use, but have never tried it.
 
 The most important thing with sway is to make sure you have enough tongue weight.  I could imagine you trying to reduce tongue weight in order to reduce the severe sag, but that just set up the sway situation.  The tongue weight needs to be at least 10% and preferrably up to 15% of the total trailer weight.
 
 Some other anti-sway suggestions:
 * Keep trailer tires at their maximum pressure.
 * Keep TV tires at their ideal pressure (usually about 5 pounds more in the rear and 3 pounds more in the front than Chevy recommends without the trailer).
 * Put heaviest passengers in the front of the Astro (I ll bet you re already doing this).
 * Tow with the water tanks on the Mesa empty.
 
 I think it s unfortunate, but Chevy has been softening the suspension of the Astro for years.  People complain that it rides like a truck.  Personally, I d rather it ride like a truck.  That s because it is a truck.  The Astro is built by Chevy s Truck division, and most are sold as service vans (think plumbers, appliance repair, etc.) not passenger vehicles.
 
 Late-model Astros can make excellent tow vehicles, but the soft rear suspensions they ve had for the last 4-5 years demand a WDH.
 
 Austin (Used a Mini-350 for many years without a problem)

angelsmom10

#4
Jul 17, 2003, 09:38 AM
 AustinBoston
 
QuoteORIGINAL:  AustinBoston
 
 Campingeyedoc,
 
 No matter what anybody tells you, DO NOT use air bags, helper springs, air shocks, or other suspension enhancements with your Astro.
 
 ......

 What about our Dodge Dakota -- what would be your suggestion?  Everyone DH has talked to recommends the air bags or helper springs?  Any suggestions?
 

Jo Ann

#5
Jul 17, 2003, 09:58 AM
 campingeyedocGee nancy...maybe you should check with dodge...especially since ab said about the warrenty.  I am just glad we have the ram 1500...and we use it maily for camping.

angelsmom10

#6
Jul 17, 2003, 10:03 AM
 Jo AnnTV is not under warranty, and DH can do the work himself, so I just wanted other peoples opinion.

mike4947

#7
Jul 17, 2003, 10:16 AM
 campingeyedocEyedoc. listen to Austin, there s good advise there.
 
 Just to add to it, my father was an " Astro Nut" . He owned three of them and I was in charge of setting them up and maintaining them.
 First, GM requires WDH at over 2000 pounds tow weight or 200 pounds tongue weight. If you got away without it on your last Astro consider yourself lucky.
 The rear tires/springs on newer Astro s just don t seem to be up to the challenge of towing like the older versions were. Check the Astro s tire pressure and keep it where the manual says for towing.
 
 The Reese Mini WD350 is an excellent match for the Astro/Mesa. Combines WD & sway control in one unit.  Reese makes a version with special bars just to clear the Coleman side mounted jack.

Tim5055

#8
Jul 17, 2003, 10:49 AM
 campingeyedocFirst of all, I agree with otheres that a WD hitch is probably the best idea for you.  In my case I needed the ability to carry a heavier load in the back of the pick up when not towing.
 
 I was never happy with the way my truck " sat"  with the pop up on the rear so I began investigating ways to make it ride more level.  Suggestions included air shocks, leaf spring overload kits, air bag systems, and coil spring/shock systems.
 
 I eliminated anything having to do with the shocks (i.e. air shocks and spring/shock systems) as this moves weight to the shock mounting bolts which were not designed to carry a load.
 
 I narrowed my choice down to two, a leaf spring overload system and Timbren Aeon Rubber Springs.  I must admit, price won out.  The leaf spring system was $185 + $15 shipping and the Timbrens were $278 for my truck.
 
 The three leaf overload installed in less than an hour right in the driveway.   Please remember, the installation of an overload system does NOT increase your axle weight rating, it just helps it ride level.
 
 If you go to the [link=http://www.huskyspring.com]Husky Spring Web Page[/link] and select " Overload Kits"  on the left side you will see all the options.
 
 

Jeffrey

#9
Jul 17, 2003, 11:01 AM
 campingeyedocJust a guess........ Are they both AWD?
 
 I have a  95 Astro and a  99 Safari
 
 The  95 Astro has a much stiffer back end, The  99 Safari sags alot more too.
 
 But I always figured it was because the  95 is AWD and my  99 is rear wheel drive.
 
 My doesn t sag enough to worry about, but my trailer is lighter then yours.
 But, I do use a sway bar.

campingeyedoc

#10
Jul 17, 2003, 11:32 PM
 campingeyedocBoth vehicles were RWD, not all wheel. Also, If i go with the reese mini, does that mean that I have to scrap the new hitch I just bought? Or can I just add U-haul s weight distribution bars to my existing hitch?

mike4947

#11
Jul 18, 2003, 12:39 AM
 campingeyedocThe Reese mini350 WD hitch fits into the 2 inch receive tube on your hitch replacing your current drawbar and ball. You can look at it here: http://www.reeseprod.com./   under: products/weight distribution/Mini-Lite Weight Distribution

6Quigs

#12
Jul 18, 2003, 07:34 AM
 mike4947We have a  02 Safari, and use the Reese Mini 350 like most people, and have no issues with sag or sway.
 There a few photos of the installation on my web page
 http://the6quigleys.tripod.com/camping/id6.html

wssfetch

#13
Jul 18, 2003, 11:12 AM
 campingeyedocMy 2001 Astro sank a lot more in the rear than my 1994 Safari did.  Called the hitch dealer to see about having class 2 hitch removed and a Mini 350 installed.  He talked me out of it and talked me into air bags instead.  These have worked like a charm, particularly since when loaded with dogs and dog crates and luggage the rear end was sagging even when the PU was not hitched to it.  Have not had any braking problem and have had warranty work performed after the bags were installed with no problems.

PopupSgt

#14
Jul 20, 2003, 03:13 PM
 campingeyedocI to found that the rear end of my 2001 Safari was to soft for the new Jayco that we purchased.  A wdh would have solved my problems but since the Jayco has the surge brake system I cannot use the wdh with this braking system.  
 The air bag system solved my problem by bringing the TV back to the ride height position plus when I m not towing the put I can place the bike rack on the back of the van or a storage box & inflate the air bags back to the TV s ride height, especially on long trips w/ the kids due to weight of the kids & the stuff we carry.
 I guess to each his own on the air bag system but I love them and they have performed well for me.
 I m not being an advocate for or against the air bag system but for us it was the only solution with the surge brake system & I am able to use the bags for more than just towing the camper.
 
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