RE: Coleman or Starcraft?

[wapiti]

 
The DW, DKs, dog and I are starting the research into buying a PU.
 Can t afford the F350 CC DW 6 liter TD with the slide-in right now or for the forseable future.
 
 Have had some experience wih the Jayco (was in the family) but was only moderately impressed.
 
 Looking for a long lasting, as trouble free as can be, reliable PU. I live in the Denver metro area and the Ketleson dealership is well respected in some circles and they carry the Coleman brand. Starcraft also has a fairly strong presence here.
 
 SO between the two, have all of you seen any major craftsmanship differences or does it basically come down to floorplans and options?
 
 Apologize if this is duplicating a thread I am unware about.
 
 Wapiti
 

[RamblingWreck]

 wapiti
Wapiti, great minds think a like.  I posted a similar question about the same time as you.  Starcraft recently sold off their Starcraft RV division.  This is stated quite clearly on the Starcaft RV website.
 
 I saw a post on e-opinions where some one wrote that Jayco was the purchaser of Starcraft RV but have not been able to verify this elsewhere.
 
 For sure, there are many similarities between the Jayco and Starcraft websites.  The companies are located near one another.  I suppose it is possible they hired the same independent web developer.  
 
 More telling are the warranty terms and conditions.  The written terms between Jayco and Starcraft look just about identical to me.
 
 I tried to make a side by side comparison at the Hartfor RV show last weekend.  Taking a quick walk around I noticed the boards under the end bunks on the Jayco s were pieced while the Starcrafts used a solid single board.
 
 I mention the possible Jayco / Starcraft relationship because the company I work for has purchased a number of competitors over the years.  As the engineering departments merge the difference between products becomes more subtle.  Another example in the automotive industry are stable mates from Ford/Mercury or GM Divisions.  
 
 A number of board members here at popup times have suggested that I purchase from a dealer who stands behind and supports what he sells.  I have spoken to co-workers and gotten much the same advise.
 
 One co-worker who has had experience with a number of manufactures had this to say, " Weight and cost are large considerations in the design and construction of a popup trailer.  Keeping the weight to a minimum at an affordable price means sacraficing some structural integrity.  Wear and tear from transport and use will take their toll.  Be prepared to make repairs yourself or know your dealer well."    While this fellow seems to be a real stickler I expect there is some merit to his observations.
 
 With respect toColeman, I spoke to Coleman owner who said he purchased his because in his opinon it was well built.  He spoke highly of the boards under the end bunks on the Coleman s being one piece and supported by steel framing instead aluminum.  
 
 Others on these pages have complained about ABS roof sag on Coleman.  I have read posts indicating Coleman has a new roof for this model year.  Someone asked, if it was prudent to purchase a Coleman during the introductory year of the new roof?
 
 A little food for thought.  Hope everything turns out well.
 
 Rambleing Wreck
 
 

[brainpause]

 wapiti
Well said, Ramblin.
 
 I own a Palomino (good price, good timing, etc), but I am a big huge fan of the Colemans, especially since the local dealer is so good. I deal with them lots.
 
 However, if there were a good Starcraft dealer near us, I would surely have to consider them, because I feel like they are solid units. Almost any time you see an older camper at the cg, if you look closely, it is likely a Starcraft.
 
 Hope this opinion counts, since I own neither (except for the Niagara in my dreams).
 
 Larry

[Gone-Camping]

 wapiti
I have owned 3 PU s, two of them were older model Starcraft s, and the current unit a Coleman. While I was looking and considering buying, I looked at just about everything made, and it came down to the same 2 your considering, the Starcraft and the Coleman. To be honest, I didn t see much of a difference in the two, except that I could get more trailer & goodies for my dollar with the Starcraft. I was also looking only at trailers with Slide-out dinette s, and the Starcraft slide s further out than the Coleman does, and had what I thought was a much better roof/top on it.
 
 However, I was offered a deal I couldn t pass up on a slightly used Coleman, and though I don t actually own the rig yet, I ve had possession of last season, and full use of it. I should become the legal owner of this trailer by the end of next month too!
 
 Starcraft was indeed bought out by Jayco, but they are not built in the same place. Starcraft is still run as a seperate company, and they are still being built the same way as before. That being said, I was not overly impressed with Jayco either, and wrote them off in the early going of my search. Both the Starcraft and Coleman have great warranties, and both make a great product. When it comes down to it, you ll know which camper to buy between these two when you see it... It ll just kind of hit you like a frieght train!
 
 Good luck in your search, and hope you find what you re looking for.

[camphost]

 wapiti
Our first PU was a Lark that we purchased used back in the mid 70 s because it was all we could afford.  We liked it fine, but hated the 2 piece door and how heavy it was for a small, simple camper.  Vowed we would never have a 2 piece door again.  After 2 seasons use we traded for a new 1978 Coleman Brandywine LTD, we LOVED it !! Used it for many seasons.  Had NOT one complaint.  Sold it when we got out of camping for many reasons.  3 years ago when we came back to PU camping we purchased a used 99 Coleman Westlake and liked it fine, except did not like climbing over the bunk to get to the bed and the previous owner had beat it up a little.  Last winter had the opportunity to buy new.  We took our time and researched every brand and went to lots of dealers and lots of shows.  Really took and time and ended up with another Coleman, the 2002 Niagara.  Used it all last season, every weekend March - November.  LOVE IT!!  Do not have any complaints.  The converter went up due to a lightening strike and we did not want to haul it to the dealer, so they gave us the new one and the park electrician helped us install it ourselves.  Our dealer has been great and we love our Coleman.

[Gamecock Camper]

 wapiti
Ok, here s my story and I m stickin to it.  I really believe that each brand and even each model within a brand has its strengths and weaknesses.  For the most part I think that more comes down to layout and options than anything else.  Most manufacturers are using sufficient frames and axles, but some models have a more rigid frame (its got to be better).  I think that any PU less than 10 years old  is built well enough for the most part.  The only glaring exception is the Coleman ABS roof, which is still not really something that I would avoid if I were the original owner as Coleman has stood behind fixing any problems that occured on the ABS roofs.   I would not have a problem with the new Coleman roof either if I were buying a new camper as they have stood behind fixing any problems.  If you are looking for used though, the only thing I would steer clear of is any used Coleman with the ABS roof as the warranty is not valid except to the original owner..... just my preference.    There are plenty of good used Colemans out there though... and many of them do not have the ABS roof or have had the ABS roof replaced with the new roof.
 
 When I was first looking for a camper I didn t look for a long time or do alot of research.  My first pop-up camper was a Jayco Quest 10v.  I ended up being very pleased with the quality of build, how it towed, amount of storage, etc.    When looking for an upgrade I looked at all brands and models with the wish list of layout, size and options.  I ended up buying a Rockwood with a dinnette slideout and front storage trunk and about every option possible on a pop-up camper.  The Rockwood is only 2ft longer, but has a weight that is just a little less than double that of the Jayco.  The frame is stronger and the tires are more significant on the Rockwood.  The cabinets are definetely more solid on the Rockwood, so there is a tradeoff as the heavier frame and cabinets require towing extra weight.  
 
 Both Starcraft and Coleman are good brands, but don t sell the other brands short until you take a look at the newer Jaycos, Rockwoods, Vikings, etc....  You might find more if you have an open mind.    
 

[wapiti]

 wapiti
Thanks to all for the come back.
 
 We re going to try to hit a couple of dealerships in town this weekend to ponder layouts and options but to mainly get a feel for dealers.
 
 We are keeping an open mind on PU manufacturers, but Coleman and Starcraft seem to have the most presence here, ie probably more dealer support.
 
 Thanks for the heads-up on ABS Coleman roofs. And all your comments have opened my eyes for things consider and be on the lookout for.
 
 Ain t the web great?
 
 Wapiti
 10-10 on the side

[colomtn]

 wapiti
Wapiti,
 We recently went through the same situation as you are going through, I have reasearched all of the popup manufacturers for the last year( coleman, jayco, starcraft, forest river, etc) and the coleman came out on top, we purchased a santa fe 2 weeks ago at the colorado rv show. IMO the coleman is superior to most of the other pu s, fleetwood seems to really pay attention to details, some of the other manufacturers lack the craftsmanship. I also have great things to say about ketelson campers, they know their product, you will find some dealers know little about the popups they sell, our buying experience was very pleasant. FYI, ketelson is the top coleman dealer in the U.S. []

[wapiti]

 colomtn
Colomtn,
 
 Yeah, I was sorry to miss the show. Would have been a good opportunity to compare. We re heading to Ketelson tomorrow. Everyone I know who has delt with Ketelson has had good things to say about the experience.
 
 Thanks

[colomtn]

 wapiti
BTW,
 what model starcraft or coleman are you looking for?

[wapiti]

 wapiti
Colomtn,
 
 Well, not quite sure yet. Need to touch and feel plus always consider GVWR.
 Our Chevy WB Venture has TR of 3500. But at altitude here, one should take off about 700 lbs. of that. So, that leaves a trailer in the dry weight arena of around 1800 to 2100 lbs. We need room. 2 kids and a choc lab and too much stuff.
 
 One weight consideration is that we definitely want an AC unit as an option. My DW is from the Midwest and we go back often. We hit Ponca SP in north eastern Nebraska in July a couple of years ago. 6:00 p.m., 96 degrees and what felt like 90% humidity. Was borrowing my parent s slide-in for the trip and thank God it had AC.
 
 Any ways, some research on the web has me heading in the direction of the Santa Fe or Cheyenne. Would love the 12 foot box but those start climbing the GVWRs. Though the Tacoma might be in the ballpark. I know from a friends that the 8  box would be on the smallish side.
 
 Starcraft? Well, my DW has mentioned perhaps the cassette toilet for the kids at least. So the 2406 of the Starcraft Series is something to look at. It s GVWR is listed at only 2820. But that makes me wonder where the weight went and how much one can pack etc. Plus I m not keen on the end dinette. So maybe the Launch series 2420L w/o the cassette.
 
 So, a lot to look at and consider. We re just starting the journey to owning a PU.
 
 Wapiti

[Opie431]

 wapiti
We looked at Coleman and Starcraft but decided that coleman was haing so much trouble with it roofs that we had best avoid them.  They then changed the roofs and still had probalems.
 Starcraft had a problem also but issued a recall, Coleman only replaces roofs free for first owners.
 Our Starcraft 1999 has never had any problems and we camp sixty days a year.
 

[tlhdoc]

 wapiti
Wapiti if you would happen to run across a 99 Coleman Nevada it might have everything you want.  I towed mine for 3 years with a Ford Windstar.  It is a 10 foot box with a shower/cassette potty.   You can look at the floor plan at my webshots site.  The most important thing is a good dealer.  Good luck on the hunt for the perfect PU.[]

[mwh710]

 wapiti
Just my 2 cents.  My 2000  Coleman Utah CP was in 6 times for warranty repair the first year.  It spent time in the shop than camping.  The worst part is the the dealer who fights every repair, & the servicemen that rarely get it right the first time.  I will buy anything but a cOleman next time around, simply because of the lousy treatment we have received at the dealer.  Oh, & yes our roof was replaced a couple of months ago & yes we had to take it back again, because we were missing stuff that was in our original roof that wasn t there on the new one.  Always a hassle.  We were told not to get upset, what s the big deal, it s only some snaps.  Yeah, it s the snaps that hold up the privacy curtain around the toilet.  Another day wasted at the Coleman dealer.  NEVER AGAIN!!!!!  Check out the dealer, some past customers of the dealer and the product.  Coleman is made as cheap as they come.  Maybe I just have a lemon, I BTW bought it new.  I d like a Rockwood. []

[topcat7736]

 wapiti
I m glad we bought a Fleetwood/Coleman. The Santa Fe is excellent and one of their most popular models. The frame and lifter systems are the strongest in the industry and Sunbrella tenting is much thicker than tarp style plastic. They aren t subject to mildew and can be serviced nationwide. Everything about them feels stronger and more built to last.
 
 Pick a good dealer, (like we did) and you ll not be unhappy with your purchase. []