Light Pop Up Questions

[helmet]

Wondering if someone can help me out.  I am searching for my first pop up but I am having trouble.  My tow vehicle is a Subaru Outback which can tow 2000lbs but with a warning that the pop up should have brakes (electric) if the pop up weights over 1000 lbs.  Can anybody give me any feedback on what dry weight I should stay under so I dont ruin my car?  Also, is there an online web source that compares campers?  Or can somebody recommend a camper that the tow with a car?

Thanks,

Dean

[TheViking]

That's gonna be tough, 2000LBS. Here is the smallest P-UP Viking sells, the Epic Series 1706. Without your gear and family loaded it is already overweight for your TV. Figure out what the weight of all the people that will be in the TV when you go camping (tell the wife to be honest, this is important) , ball park a weight for gear you would take(500LBS min) and then deduct that from the 2000LB rating. That will give you a very general idea.
 
Dry Weight # 1405#
Cargo Capacity  750#
Gross Vehicle Weight Rating  2155#
 
Weights are Approx

[mike4947]

Well it's best to forget "dry weight" entirely. First no one EVER towed a trailer off the dealer lot at dry weight. Way to amny things are not included in the "dry weight".

Start looking at the GVWR's or the heaviest the unit should weight and start your selection there. What we do is make a certified weight slip a deal breaker. If the dealership won't weight the trailer for us beforw we sign we walk away. Over the years we've seen too many RV's of all types not just PU's come off the dealer lot AT or OVER the GVWR.

[fritz_monroe]

There are several pop ups that you can tow easily, but most are not the main stream brands.  Take a look at Lite Tent Camper, Kamparoo, Windward Campers.

And don't forget to take a look at Chalet, they advertise that Subaru Outbacks can tow their trailer.

[helmet]

Thanks for the response and resources.  My research has led me to the  2000 Starcraft Meteor.  It has a dry weight of 1200 and a GVWR of 2000 which should be fine for my subaru outback.  Does anyone have an opinion on the 2000 Starcraft Meteor?

[TheViking]

Thanks for the response and resources. My research has led me to the 2000 Starcraft Meteor. It has a dry weight of 1200 and a GVWR of 2000 which should be fine for my subaru outback. Does anyone have an opinion on the 2000 Starcraft Meteor?

 
 Just remember,  1200LBS dry-  That leaves 800Lbs that will include all the stuff you keep in the pup, gear you take in the outback, and the weight of the people in it as well.  Also, Water in the pup and full propane tank is not included in the dry weight either.  The rule is that your trailer should be 10% under the towing capacity of the TV.  I'm not trying to break your b@#*'s, just trying to make sure you get as educated as I did when I found this site. Plus, if you're towing at, or above you're capacity, that's alot more wear and tear on your transmission and engine  when going up hills, etc.  Just my 2 cents

[brainpause]

Here's an idea:

http://www.bf-specialties.com/

Some friends recently bought one, and when set up, this thing is HUGE! They bought it to tow behind a PT Cruiser.

Larry

[dthurk]

Just remember,  1200LBS dry-  That leaves 800Lbs that will include all the stuff you keep in the pup, gear you take in the outback, and the weight of the people in it as well.  Also, Water in the pup and full propane tank is not included in the dry weight either.  The rule is that your trailer should be 10% under the towing capacity of the TV.  I'm not trying to break your b@#*'s, just trying to make sure you get as educated as I did when I found this site. Plus, if you're towing at, or above you're capacity, that's alot more wear and tear on your transmission and engine  when going up hills, etc.  Just my 2 cents

So many letters and number here, it gets confusing.  Viking are you intending GCWR (Gross Combined Weight Rating) here?  GVWR (Gross Vehicle Weight Rating) is the total weight of that vehicle only.  2000 GVWR should be the total weight of the trailer only.  That includes the camper, gear, fluids and everything else on or attached to the trailer.  GCWR is the total weight of everything...tow vehicle AND trailer, all gear, passengers, fluids, everything.  The Suburu should have a GCWR as well as a tow capacity rating.  A Suburu dealer should be able to look it up for you.  Unless I'm missing something here (and maybe I am), the tow capacity should not necessarily include gear and people in the tow vehicle.

[SpeakEasy]

So many letters and number here, it gets confusing.  Viking are you intending GCWR (Gross Combined Weight Rating) here?  GVWR (Gross Vehicle Weight Rating) is the total weight of that vehicle only.  2000 GVWR should be the total weight of the trailer only.  That includes the camper, gear, fluids and everything else on or attached to the trailer.  GCWR is the total weight of everything...tow vehicle AND trailer, all gear, passengers, fluids, everything.  The Suburu should have a GCWR as well as a tow capacity rating.  A Suburu dealer should be able to look it up for you.  Unless I'm missing something here (and maybe I am), the tow capacity should not necessarily include gear and people in the tow vehicle.

You are correct; and it does get confusing.

For example, my Highlander is rated to tow 3500 lb. Here's what my owner's manual says about trailer weight:
"The total trailer weight (trailer weight plus its cargo load) must not exceed the following. Exceeding this weight is dangerous. 3500 lb."

Then it goes on to discuss gross combination weight: "The gross combination weight (sum of your vehicle weight plus its load and the total trailer weight) must not exceed the following. 7985 lb."

Now, if you subtract 3500 from 7985 you get 4485, which is the weight of my Highlander plus its gear, plus passengers plus trailer tongue weight.  Nowhere is there any indication that gear and passengers in the Highlander should be considered part of the 3500 lb trailer capacity.

When the car manufacturer uses the term "vehicle" (the "V" in GVWR), they are referring to the tow vehicle, not the trailer.

I've been told that Toyota calculates and reports on GCWR differently than do other manufacturers. When dthurk says GCWR inlcudes the vehicle AND the trailer, that is not true for me. My owner's manual says this about GCWR: "The gross vehicle weight is the sum of weights of the unloaded vehicle, driver, passengers, luggage, hitch, and trailer tongue load." SO - it includes the trailer tongue load (which makes sense to me), but not the weight of the trailer. I think the reason for this is that the trailer weight (downward force due to gravity) does not bear on the frame of the tow vehicle, other than the weight of the tongue.

I think anyone who posts here should be aware that there may be different calculations for different auto manufacturers. What dthurk says at the end is the bottom line: get the straight story from your car dealer. They are the only ones who really know what their vehicles are made to be able to do.

[TheViking]

So many letters and number here, it gets confusing. Viking are you intending GCWR (Gross Combined Weight Rating) here? GVWR (Gross Vehicle Weight Rating) is the total weight of that vehicle only. 2000 GVWR should be the total weight of the trailer only. That includes the camper, gear, fluids and everything else on or attached to the trailer. GCWR is the total weight of everything...tow vehicle AND trailer, all gear, passengers, fluids, everything. The Suburu should have a GCWR as well as a tow capacity rating. A Suburu dealer should be able to look it up for you. Unless I'm missing something here (and maybe I am), the tow capacity should not necessarily include gear and people in the tow vehicle.

Go here: http://rveducation101.com/Articles/TowVehicleTrailer.pdf
 
Yes you do have to include gear and people, it adds weight to the vehicle.

[vjm1639]

Yes, check with your dealer....  I have a Subaru also even though i don't tow with it...but our dealer told us that with Subaru (also Honda I believe) you don't have to count the weight of the passengers, that it is somehow already included in the vehicles weight when they figure the tow ratings. He said for Subaru and Honda the tow rating number is the ACTUAL weight you can tow.

[helmet]

First, thanks for all the info.  What a great community. I will check with my local Subaru dealer although I am hoping I get accurate info.

I did check my Subaru manual and my exact weight ratings are this :
GVWR - 4555
GAWR - 2210
Total Trailer weight (towing capacity) - 2000

It is my belief that my pop up with gear in the pop up cannot exceed 2000 lbs.  Passengers and gear in the tow vehicle (subaru) are not included in this number.

[New2Pop]

Yes, check with your dealer....  I have a Subaru also even though i don't tow with it...but our dealer told us that with Subaru (also Honda I believe) you don't have to count the weight of the passengers, that it is somehow already included in the vehicles weight when they figure the tow ratings. He said for Subaru and Honda the tow rating number is the ACTUAL weight you can tow.

Wow, this is good news!  I'm new to all this and had a few questions but I guess they have been answered by the above comment. This means I can put 5 people,motorcycles and camping gear in the back of my TV and it will not have any effect on towing weight whatsoever.  Cool.

[SpeakEasy]

Wow, this is good news!  I'm new to all this and had a few questions but I guess they have been answered by the above comment. This means I can put 5 people,motorcycles and camping gear in the back of my TV and it will not have any effect on towing weight whatsoever.  Cool.

Yes and no.

If you are towing with a Toyota (or apparently a Subaru or a Honda), then, technically you are correct. However, there are other weight ratings that you have to take into account, that have nothing to do with towing. Your vehicle has a weight rating that you cannot exceed. (Forget about towing for the moment.) Your 5 people, motorcycles, and camping gear will impact that rating.

[New2Pop]

Yes and no.

If you are towing with a Toyota (or apparently a Subaru or a Honda), then, technically you are correct. However, there are other weight ratings that you have to take into account, that have nothing to do with towing. Your vehicle has a weight rating that you cannot exceed. (Forget about towing for the moment.) Your 5 people, motorcycles, and camping gear will impact that rating.

Ok, So I have an 06 Ridgeline, I have a GVW of 6,050, I can tow 5000Lbs, and I have a payload capacity of 1550.  Therefore, I can have a 5000Lb trailer loaded, 1550Lbs in the truck (Not including people), and it will not put any stess on the truck whatsoever?  Because that's what the "General" consenses seems to be here except for a couple of people.